[CL12] Prediction Contest, Winner: 4 U 2 NV

[JPlo64]

Don't want to make your calls on which of the very much incomplete FOED/A^ match ups you think you won?

I don't think ICON finishes 4th but I do think they have a good shot to avoid relegations. At this point, the FOED vs ICON matchup is probably the most important. If 4 points go either way then I think the winner is safe, the loser is relegated. If it is a 2-2 split I think things will be much closer and could cause some problems... especially with the Pelo war game that could potentially drag out a long time if Red is not killed quickly. I'd bet on LHDD getting 4th as of now, although if they fail to take 2 points off S&M then obviously not.

I don't think we finish 4th either. We get minimum 1pt from A^ and minimum 3pts from FOED. The round I haven't counted in my table is vs A^. I have us down as getting 4pts from FOED, but the 1pt could change on that.

Assuming LHDD get 4pts vs RET they finish on 15, by my count. I think they're splitting 2pts each with S&M too.

You need a big upset vs FALL from what I see.

I'll bet a pretty penny you don't get more than 2 off FOED

[iAmCaffeine]

i bet you 2 pennies

[iAmCaffeine]

wait when i wrote that i had in my head that a win was 3pts hahaha im stupid as f*ck hot damn. too much footy on the brain.

so what i mean is we're getting 2pts minimum from foed, in our home set.

[iAmCaffeine]

Don't want to make your calls on which of the very much incomplete FOED/A^ match ups you think you won?

I don't think ICON finishes 4th but I do think they have a good shot to avoid relegations. At this point, the FOED vs ICON matchup is probably the most important. If 4 points go either way then I think the winner is safe, the loser is relegated. If it is a 2-2 split I think things will be much closer and could cause some problems... especially with the Pelo war game that could potentially drag out a long time if Red is not killed quickly. I'd bet on LHDD getting 4th as of now, although if they fail to take 2 points off S&M then obviously not.

I don't think we finish 4th either. We get minimum 1pt from A^ and minimum 3pts from FOED. The round I haven't counted in my table is vs A^. I have us down as getting 4pts from FOED, but the 1pt could change on that.

Assuming LHDD get 4pts vs RET they finish on 15, by my count. I think they're splitting 2pts each with S&M too.

You need a big upset vs FALL from what I see.

I'll bet a pretty penny you don't get more than 2 off FOED

still making that bet?

[i-andrei]

Lol, we could have a clean sheet on our home set

[Caymanmew]

At this point, I have ICON as 99.9% safe from relegation. FOED 99.9% relegated.

It is between LHDD and ATL for the last spot.

[rockfist]

FOED in division two will be a blood bath.

[Nut Shot Scott]

At this point, I have ICON as 99.9% safe from relegation. FOED 99.9% relegated.

It is between LHDD and ATL for the last spot.

It's gonna be super close with all 3 of us.

[ProStrategos]

I'm relatively new to clans and especially this clan league thing. I'm just trying to understand from the thread so far, but wanted to clarify: do the bottom-3 teams get relegated every year? Also, my impression was LHDD was / is historically a good team - is it common or normal to be relegated from Division 1?

I also don't see an official clan league table or standings, let me know if I'm just blind haha.

Thanks in advance for any info.

[Sanguis]

I'm relatively new to clans and especially this clan league thing. I'm just trying to understand from the thread so far, but wanted to clarify: do the bottom-3 teams get relegated every year? Also, my impression was LHDD was / is historically a good team - is it common or normal to be relegated from Division 1?

I also don't see an official clan league table or standings, let me know if I'm just blind haha.

Thanks in advance for any info.

This is the prediction contest thread.

This link leads you to the CL12 Premier Division standings: https://challonge.com/nl/8cs678h7/standings

Cheers

[Caymanmew]

I'm relatively new to clans and especially this clan league thing. I'm just trying to understand from the thread so far, but wanted to clarify: do the bottom-3 teams get relegated every year? Also, my impression was LHDD was / is historically a good team - is it common or normal to be relegated from Division 1?

I also don't see an official clan league table or standings, let me know if I'm just blind haha.

Thanks in advance for any info.

Offical standings don't mean much, they run too far behind.

Yes, the bottom 3 teams get relegated every year.

LHDD is a good clan, the problem is as we have less and less clans it becomes harder to avoid relegations. ATL has avoided relegations the last two years with a 6th and 7th place finish. This year you need to finish 5th to avoid relegations. So it bar keep moving and as it does better clans are going to get caught up and forced to be relegated.

[rockfist]

My opinion is that LHDD is either great or slightly above average. When they are great they beat people like rented mules and have won championships, but they can be bested by 5-6 clans when they are down. I suppose they are "good" sometimes which means there are 2-3 clans "better" at that moment too.

S&M has historically had the most success, including recently. Only TOFU or possibly Fallen can make a case for being as good (and I think its a losing argument in both situations) - and we don't make that case at TOFU. We will see them on the field. LHDD is probably 4th all time in terms of results.

[Donelladan]

I disagree with the above
Just don't see how FALL could make a case on being as good as S&M. And result wise I don't see FALL being above LHDD. You can call me biased.
I'd say TOFU can make a strong case on that we agree.

@ProStrategos, LHDD has been for approx three years I'd say, a top clan ( by that I mean top 5 at least, top 3 most of the time) , but every clan can have lower performance, S&M included had a lower performance period.
We're currently on a low period, for different reasons.

Towards your comment, I would say it is definitely not common for top clan to be relegated in the 2nd division and it would be a very bad result for us if he were indeed.
As Cayman pointed, having less clan in the 1er division is one of the reason, the other reason being that the level in the 1st clan div is more homogenous that it used to be.

[ProStrategos]

Got it, thanks for the replies everyone.

In that case... I wonder if it'd be more fair for the 3rd last team to play a clan war against the, say, 3rd seed to-be-promoted team to see who gets actually promoted. And the 2nd last and last placed teams could be automatically relegated (which I'm assuming is currently the case for all 3 relegation teams?)

Anyhow, excited to see how things turn out for the end of CL12 - especially with ICON in the mix for close placing. It's always fun to see a competitive, closely-placed league, cheers.

[benga]

Got it, thanks for the replies everyone.

In that case... I wonder if it'd be more fair for the 3rd last team to play a clan war against the, say, 3rd seed to-be-promoted team to see who gets actually promoted. And the 2nd last and last placed teams could be automatically relegated (which I'm assuming is currently the case for all 3 relegation teams?)

Anyhow, excited to see how things turn out for the end of CL12 - especially with ICON in the mix for close placing. It's always fun to see a competitive, closely-placed league, cheers.

you can open discussion here
viewforum.php?f=866

[Donelladan]

I think he cannot, only clan rep can post right ?

[rockfist]

Got it, thanks for the replies everyone.

In that case... I wonder if it'd be more fair for the 3rd last team to play a clan war against the, say, 3rd seed to-be-promoted team to see who gets actually promoted. And the 2nd last and last placed teams could be automatically relegated (which I'm assuming is currently the case for all 3 relegation teams?)

Anyhow, excited to see how things turn out for the end of CL12 - especially with ICON in the mix for close placing. It's always fun to see a competitive, closely-placed league, cheers.

'
This would make sense to me. I'm not trying to stir up things but third in the 2nd division can sometimes be quite weak...and if three or four teams are promoted in soccer leagues those are usually 18 or 20 team leagues, not 8.

Don,

My comments were not meant to be an attack or condemnation of LHDD, please don't take them that way. I just look at Fallen winning two Premier Leagues in a row, 1 Cup and being to three consecutive finals as being pretty good and trust me - it pains me to acknowledge it.

[Caymanmew]

From a results point of view, if FALL can win this CL there stats would actually be basically the same as TOFU with a CL force instead of CC focus. Given recency, I'd argue that would make it FALL>TOFU. At least from a results point of view.

Got it, thanks for the replies everyone.

In that case... I wonder if it'd be more fair for the 3rd last team to play a clan war against the, say, 3rd seed to-be-promoted team to see who gets actually promoted. And the 2nd last and last placed teams could be automatically relegated (which I'm assuming is currently the case for all 3 relegation teams?)

Anyhow, excited to see how things turn out for the end of CL12 - especially with ICON in the mix for close placing. It's always fun to see a competitive, closely-placed league, cheers.

you can open discussion here
viewforum.php?f=866

I've posted a thread on this.
viewtopic.php?f=866&t=235502

[Donelladan]

Don't worry I didn't take it as an attack.
I just think you're wrong about it. I don't believe FALL is close of making a case to be as good as S&M, and I don't think the difference between LHDD and FALL is big nor even that there is really any. You said they have one CL 1st div title on us, I say we've two RL's titles on them.
But there is no absolute measure of who's the best and different arguments could be made for either side.
You're entitled to your opinion here. LHDD was mentionned so I said my piece. Nothing more.

[rockfist]

From a results point of view, if FALL can win this CL there stats would actually be basically the same as TOFU with a CL force instead of CC focus. Given recency, I'd argue that would make it FALL>TOFU. At least from a results point of view.

Got it, thanks for the replies everyone.

In that case... I wonder if it'd be more fair for the 3rd last team to play a clan war against the, say, 3rd seed to-be-promoted team to see who gets actually promoted. And the 2nd last and last placed teams could be automatically relegated (which I'm assuming is currently the case for all 3 relegation teams?)

Anyhow, excited to see how things turn out for the end of CL12 - especially with ICON in the mix for close placing. It's always fun to see a competitive, closely-placed league, cheers.

you can open discussion here
viewforum.php?f=866

I've posted a thread on this.
viewtopic.php?f=866&t=235502

I don't think CL is as big of an accomplishment as CC - I'm not saying its nothing, but you can get great results against so-so clans and lose to the best clans and win CL. The first year Fallen won the league they kinda did that as LHDD and TOFU were focused on the Cup finals and had some pretty poor results in League until that was winding down but then came on strong at the end and we at least beat Fallen pretty good over the 16 total games that year. If you lose at all you don't win CC. Also, although they have been ranked number one in the 400 ratings Fallen does not have anywhere near the time ranked number one or in the top two, three, or five that TOFU does.

[ProStrategos]

From a results point of view, if FALL can win this CL there stats would actually be basically the same as TOFU with a CL force instead of CC focus. Given recency, I'd argue that would make it FALL>TOFU. At least from a results point of view.

Got it, thanks for the replies everyone.

In that case... I wonder if it'd be more fair for the 3rd last team to play a clan war against the, say, 3rd seed to-be-promoted team to see who gets actually promoted. And the 2nd last and last placed teams could be automatically relegated (which I'm assuming is currently the case for all 3 relegation teams?)

Anyhow, excited to see how things turn out for the end of CL12 - especially with ICON in the mix for close placing. It's always fun to see a competitive, closely-placed league, cheers.

you can open discussion here
viewforum.php?f=866

I've posted a thread on this.
viewtopic.php?f=866&t=235502

Thanks Cayman. Couldn't seem to reply to the other thread, but I just wanted to say having at least 1 automatic relegation makes things more exciting, in my opinion. It incentivizes clans to try harder during the league and not just tank if their opponent in Division 2 don't seem strong enough to beat them in the heads-up relegation match.

The other points all make sense to me, especially changing the size of division and number of teams that get relegated (maybe to 2), which I'll leave to more experienced people. Cheers.

[Caymanmew]

From a results point of view, if FALL can win this CL there stats would actually be basically the same as TOFU with a CL force instead of CC focus. Given recency, I'd argue that would make it FALL>TOFU. At least from a results point of view.

Got it, thanks for the replies everyone.

In that case... I wonder if it'd be more fair for the 3rd last team to play a clan war against the, say, 3rd seed to-be-promoted team to see who gets actually promoted. And the 2nd last and last placed teams could be automatically relegated (which I'm assuming is currently the case for all 3 relegation teams?)

Anyhow, excited to see how things turn out for the end of CL12 - especially with ICON in the mix for close placing. It's always fun to see a competitive, closely-placed league, cheers.

you can open discussion here
viewforum.php?f=866

I've posted a thread on this.
viewtopic.php?f=866&t=235502

Thanks Cayman. Couldn't seem to reply to the other thread, but I just wanted to say having at least 1 automatic relegation makes things more exciting, in my opinion. It incentivizes clans to try harder during the league and not just tank if their opponent in Division 2 don't seem strong enough to beat them in the heads-up relegation match.

The other points all make sense to me, especially changing the size of division and number of teams that get relegated (maybe to 2), which I'll leave to more experienced people. Cheers.

Only the rep for each clan can post in that subforum, for ICON it is Caff, so you can put your ideas to him and he can post them.

[hopalong]

sorry to hijack your prediction thread, Jpl!

agree with rock - cup, imo, is more of an accomplishment then league given the depth of clan needed to go all the way, the overall war planning required in 40+ game wars, and that luck has more of a chance to even out in large sets than smaller sets.

[Caymanmew]

sorry to hijack your prediction thread, Jpl!

agree with rock - cup, imo, is more of an accomplishment then league given the depth of clan needed to go all the way, the overall war planning required in 40+ game wars, and that luck has more of a chance to even out in large sets than smaller sets.

I disagree with the suggestion that Cup requires more or more difficult war planning. I spend far more time on League than Cup as with League I must consider not only what maps we are best at but also how and who to use them against to provide us with the best shot at victory in all matchups.

[iAmCaffeine]

League arguably requires more planning, but the Cup is harder to win.