EW's Semi-Open Matrix Madness

[SoN!c]

My educated guess on that is Fusi

[strike wolf]

Strike, you are at L-2, obviously you would claim vanilla town but I would really like to hear your side before I cast my vote.

What's the case? That scum made a smart move and I'm smart and I'm not as active as usual? There are other smart players and it's summer, I've been doing a lot more gardening and swimming and generally been busy. I've still managed to be more active than many other players and when I have been able to post, I've been helpful and analytical about the game.

I'm really curious as to Son!c jumping on so quickly. Vot throwing a vote out there isn't surprising but for Son!c to jump on a case so quickly when I'm sure he knows that we need to get today right or all but guarantee that scum wins reeks a bit to me. Of course, King did the same but he's pretty much proven town at this point.

I feel fairly confident that between Rag, Kong, Charle and Son!c well probably find at least two scum. Kong and Rag seem the more likely to be paired as I caught a whiff of Rag defending Kong a bit yesterday and he was quick to try to back off and make it out to just be a joke. Kong I've already stated my reasons multiple times. Charle had the whole thing yesterday where he seemed to know we had a doc before it was officially revealed and the reasoning was rather flimsy for why he deduced that. Read the above for Son!c plus him conveniently putting all the non-confirmed townies as basically 50-50. Other than tha just looking oddly non-committal in general, town Son!c has generally been pretty committed to pushing the case he believes in hard (look at him against Traf in The Thing Mafia or him against Loose d2 of The Tick mafia). That said, of those 4, Son!c is probably the one I'm least convinced about being scum.

[SoN!c]

Unvote

Your right on all of that and why i jumped so fast following Vot: well what do you expect? We need to do something. I was hoping (pretty desperate) on scum following, tempted by seeing the finishline but no fish on the hook or no crabbies in the crab pod..and Vot is together with King our 100% confirmed town so why not follow fast?

I wanna go for Charle but i could be way off. Basically im going with the MIA theory that Strike, Dev and Kong were inactive due to summertime and the game activity that was rather slow (before i joined), combined with town getting nowhere. Its the most plausible thing i can come up with. On the other hand is staying silent the easy scum way..

[Charle]

My educated guess on that is Fusi

Yes, I also read that in Vot's post, he basically told us that between the lines.

Then the post from King that he now think he gave the item to scum, makes me also think a bit, maybe he did?

Scum cannot do anything with their PR's as we are all basically vanilla town except if Fusi can maybe block scum (if he is town), but he cannot, they are 3, so if he block 1 person the other 2 kill one of us, so it doesn't really matter.

We really have very clever scum, I was trying to get scum to kill me as the doc (tried to say between the lines that I know we have a doc), but it didn't work and they could get pmc, probaly with their tracker, they already knew who it was.

I am now basically back to zero, can it be Fusi, Devante and Kong? Maybe Fusi, Strike and Devante or Strike, Devante and Ragian?

It is definitely between Fusi, Strike, Devante Kong and Ragain, but which 3?

[SoN!c]

It is definitely between Fusi, Strike, Devante Kong and Ragain, but which 3?

Dev said he has real life issues - farm work, so did Strike. Even a funeral. I have to believe both on that. This stays a game. If you wanna win this way then lets stop playing.

[Ragian]

We know that the kill went through, and we know (right?) that Vot was blocked. Neither of those actions were performed by Devante. I asked for directions late yesterday, but I got none so I stuck to my guns. 66% chance Devante isn't scum.

I wanted Devante or Fusi yesterday, but no one wanted a piece of that. Now, several people are pointing their scumdar in Fusi's direction. Towards the end of the previous day, I wanted Strike, and now everyone is voting Strike. What does a guy have to do to be taken seriously around here?

I feel fairly confident that between Rag, Kong, Charle and Son!c well probably find at least two scum. Kong and Rag seem the more likely to be paired as I caught a whiff of Rag defending Kong a bit yesterday and he was quick to try to back off and make it out to just be a joke. Kong I've already stated my reasons multiple times. Charle had the whole thing yesterday where he seemed to know we had a doc before it was officially revealed and the reasoning was rather flimsy for why he deduced that. Read the above for Son!c plus him conveniently putting all the non-confirmed townies as basically 50-50. Other than tha just looking oddly non-committal in general, town Son!c has generally been pretty committed to pushing the case he believes in hard (look at him against Traf in The Thing Mafia or him against Loose d2 of The Tick mafia). That said, of those 4, Son!c is probably the one I'm least convinced about being scum.

Also, what the hell is this? What wiff of a defence of Kong have you gotten from me? I feel misrepresented for the second time this game. Are you and Charle in cahoots with a secret mission of slandering my good name?

[Ragian]

Your right on all of that and why i jumped so fast following Vot: well what do you expect? We need to do something. I was hoping (pretty desperate) on scum following, tempted by seeing the finishline but no fish on the hook or no crabbies in the crab pod..and Vot is together with King our 100% confirmed town so why not follow fast?

I wanna go for Charle but i could be way off. Basically im going with the MIA theory that Strike, Dev and Kong were inactive due to summertime and the game activity that was rather slow (before i joined), combined with town getting nowhere. Its the most plausible thing i can come up with. On the other hand is staying silent the easy scum way..

We don't have proof that you aren't scum jumping quick, though. Still, the town consensus seems to be that you're town. Maybe we're just very happy that someone is actually contributing

Tell me why you want to go for Charle. Because I feel you (but I fear that I'm caught in OMGUS).

[Votanic]

It is definitely between Fusi, Strike, Devante Kong and Ragain, but which 3?

Dev said he has real life issues - farm work, so did Strike. Even a funeral. I have to believe both on that. This stays a game. If you wanna win this way then lets stop playing.

Sonic this post is so wrong on multiple levels, ...thus, it's also very 'you'.

Speaking of 'wrong'.
Pixar dodging out of the game when he know he'd be replaced by Sonic was a rather low move.

...but if he was Scum, and he let himself be replaced by Sonic!?!
That would be like violating the Geneva Convention!!

Therefore, just to give Pixar's reputation the merest benefit of the doubt (and save his soul from eternal damnation), one finds oneself shoehorned into having to treat Sonic as virtually confirmed Town, ...but he really isn't.

[SoN!c]

It is definitely between Fusi, Strike, Devante Kong and Ragain, but which 3?

Dev said he has real life issues - farm work, so did Strike. Even a funeral. I have to believe both on that. This stays a game. If you wanna win this way then lets stop playing.

Sonic this post is so wrong on multiple levels, ...thus, it's also very 'you'.

Speaking of 'wrong'.
Pixar dodging out of the game when he know he'd be replaced by Sonic was a rather low move.

...but if he was Scum, and he let himself be replaced by Sonic!?!
That would be like violating the Geneva Convention!!

Therefore, just to give Pixar's reputation the merest benefit of the doubt (and save his soul from eternal damnation), one finds oneself shoehorned into having to treat Sonic as virtually confirmed Town, ...but he really isn't.

I know you hate me Vot and my playstyle. But even if / when we always clinch headstrong iron vs iron i do not hate you. As you are a native english speaker and im not i learn a few words now and then like "skulking".

Rest assured im town, and yes best reason why is because Vanilla Pixar wanted a sub, i know that - its not because of the sonic energy that im semi declared town..

Poirot (belgian detective) would say "au contraire' and something about the little cells

[SoN!c]

We know that the kill went through, and we know (right?) that Vot was blocked. Neither of those actions were performed by Devante. I asked for directions late yesterday, but I got none so I stuck to my guns. 66% chance Devante isn't scum.

I wanted Devante or Fusi yesterday, but no one wanted a piece of that. Now, several people are pointing their scumdar in Fusi's direction. Towards the end of the previous day, I wanted Strike, and now everyone is voting Strike. What does a guy have to do to be taken seriously around here?

I feel fairly confident that between Rag, Kong, Charle and Son!c well probably find at least two scum. Kong and Rag seem the more likely to be paired as I caught a whiff of Rag defending Kong a bit yesterday and he was quick to try to back off and make it out to just be a joke. Kong I've already stated my reasons multiple times. Charle had the whole thing yesterday where he seemed to know we had a doc before it was officially revealed and the reasoning was rather flimsy for why he deduced that. Read the above for Son!c plus him conveniently putting all the non-confirmed townies as basically 50-50. Other than tha just looking oddly non-committal in general, town Son!c has generally been pretty committed to pushing the case he believes in hard (look at him against Traf in The Thing Mafia or him against Loose d2 of The Tick mafia). That said, of those 4, Son!c is probably the one I'm least convinced about being scum.

Also, what the hell is this? What wiff of a defence of Kong have you gotten from me? I feel misrepresented for the second time this game. Are you and Charle in cahoots with a secret mission of slandering my good name?

I wanted you or Charle because i was almost 100% sure Max would flip town just like Swang.

If you would have flipped scum yesterday we would have had a lead today - and if you flipped town we would have had a lead also. Now we have nothing but your still alive

[kongming3]

I think it is now confirmed we most likely have no extra town information to work with for the rest of the game - I do think kingm should share who he gave his invention to earlier, especially if they are still alive. With that said, here's what we have to work with.

Votanic - Confirmed town power role given that no other townsfolk have claimed anything by now
Kingm - Confirmed town power role given that no other townsfolk have claimed anything by now

Me - floating wildcard I suppose

Strike Wolf - d1 didn't see the point of or want pmc posting vibe lists, backtracked on this shortly after but then later again doesn't like how early pmc posted it before giving a vibe list of his own - puts Dev as slightly scummy but no firm accusations end up made. later supports dev push after there is already a vote and legitimate suspicion on him as well as in the crunch zone at the end so I'd reasonably believe they aren't the same alignment. makes weird post casting doubt on fusi for potential knowing swang is scum already and trying to get him out? start of d3 makes weird point of me being suspicious and reeking of scum for thinking the whole dds/swang situation effectively just gave scum two free days for kills where any townsfolk suggesting a different lynch or caution was immediately shouted down? him immediately calling me out for pledging a free lynch vote was valid though (again, I did that to see the reactions), and does follow towny logic or scum seeing an easy way to get free towny points logic. defends and stops dev train d4

Devante - relatively absent start d1, but posted to start lynch on Loose for his math strategy, and posts again later to double down on this as well as claim not a town pr. later after no steam on loose lynch, switches to no lynch. gives late d1 vibe list after train on him where he puts ragian as leaning town, votes for swang after charle revives push for him, says he's good towny who would be happy to also switch his vote to dds if everyone is in agreement (we weren't) shared suspect of fusi ragian and charle

Ragian - d1 made a point about speaking and accusing to generate intel, which I appreciate. Cautions information from trackers and town prs being brought to towns attention because of it potentially being misleading - this doesn't really make sense though and feels like it tried to be insightful but really was just now advocating for less intel for town rather than simply advising measured caution. Gives FoS on Dev for claim, however does abstain from joining dev train later and seems to try to slow it down for either honest cautious towny reasons or subtle help from a scum mate. Is prominent pro lynch advocate and joins lynch pact 4th. does try to slow swang lynch d2 as well. goes for dev d4 making earlier pseudo defence not look as bad

*pixar*/SoN!c - d1 pixar effectively absent, pops in to throw a vote on no lynch. puts ragian as scum and charle as town d2 vibe list. votes swang after fusi

Charle - very soft answers early on, no real points made just middle of the pack concurrence type deal. eventually does catch out dds for typo where he used we for scum, but as dds was town this could theoretically have just been scum trying to make something out of nothing. Convinced to be pro lynching and throws out start of vote on devante. third to join lynch pact after me pmc. unvotes to rejuvenate and lead push against swang, joined by devante shortly after. firm and leader on getting swang out d2, argues with ragian and accuses him of defending scummate in swang. wants to kill person who vot visited

Fusibaseball - away most of d1 but is the first to start vote on Swang . later posts in support of no lynch in theory, but still keeps vote on Swang as well as decrying his value to town. says we should still vote for swang, but people voting after me, himself, and vot should be slightly incriminated for bandwagon on townie. chimes in d2 just to vote swang and speaks of layers of protection clearly on him that mean he has to go

Apologies for the delay, this took a while as it is and I absolutely did have to skim over parts and leave stuff out. We have effectively have seven viable canidates, three of which must be scum, and I'm including myself in that number for the purpose of discussion. I would reasonably say strike wolf and charle have consistently maintained some level of accusations on me, and I think we can reasonably rule out a trio involving me and one of them. That doesn't mean we can't be town, town/town, scum/or scum, town, just that we can to an extent rule out two possible types of combinations. In isolation, I'd consider dev to be the most suspicious. I haven't liked a lot of the things he's said or ways he's acted, and there's been a fair amount of shenanigans surrounding him. He's also been a shared primary suspect among fusi, charle, ragian, and me. That would then imply a trio of SoN!c, Dev, and strike wolf. Strike wolf did effectively kill the dev train d4 so there is some credence to that. SoN!c did vote for strike recently but backed off immediately after strike responded, and neither made any hard hitting accusations that the other couldn't reasonably provide an explanation for. I would be concerned however that it would all fit too nicely if things happened to just be that way.

Of the other three, I would say I trust Charle the most and Fusi the least. I think we have to consider what happens if we hit town on this lynch, because I'd argue that the game is very much still up in the air for town to win even at 4t-3m. After discussion, we would ultimately have all townsfolk side vote together with whoever is alive between vot and king as the confirmed townies (and scum would inevitably have to follow to not stand out). With that said, these potential pairings we've spotted become very valuable, and our lynch should put us on a path to victory even if we hit a town today (please note before any would-be detractors and libelists chime in then that I do still believe we should be lynching someone likely to be guilty).

With all that said, my current thought is we vote ragian. I do think he's reasonably likely to be scum if not necessarily the best candidate, but I also think that should he turn up town and require there to be a remaining group of three scum, his death (apologies in advance) would do the best job of clearly dividing the suspects into camps. If we figure out the group of three, then even in the case of a town lynch here it goes 4-3, 3-2, 2-1, and we win with lynch before mafia can get a final kill off. I'd like to hear further or alternative thoughts on the best candidate for this from our confirmed townies, though I'm sure other's including scum will comment, because ultimately I will end up having to vote together with vot and king.

[SoN!c]

What does a guy have to do to be taken seriously around here?

Touché Ragian, touché


I can only say your expertise is that high it could be scummy play.

Fusi, Charle, you or Kong. But i like your defence the best - im a sucker for honey pies if "dame blanche" served and that is what you just did..

What a game love it - this is mafia madness if we get it right!!

[SoN!c]

Lets go for Charle

In any scum "well played" scenario Charle is at least the middleman.

Sorry Charle, you are Colonel Mustard of the Clue game to me, always the gentleman and i love you to death

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Love you buddy, CC mafia games need you but i need to vote you in this one

[SoN!c]

And Vot, you should follow me here, you got to choose a lot already but they were all town hits.. give and take? Unless you wanna go for Fusi or Kong

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?

[Votanic]

Thank you for that long post, Kong. I didn't follow all of it, annd I don't agree with all I could follow. Also, there are some glaring omissions, but I can't fault you that, since a complete summary would be beyond human endurance to either write or read. Still, reducing your self-analysis to just being a 'wild card' seems far too easy.
Voting Ragian is very tempting... His frequently snarky tone often comes off as scummy to me, but honestly, he acts that way as Town too.

Let me try to pull together another summary. Yes, these can be dismissed as just 'busy-work', ...but who knows? Perhaps real insight will come.

1. Strike Wolf Gives townish advice. So what? No major controversies. So what? Has excuse for minimal attendance. So what?
He gets kind of miffed if he is pressed,but I've seen him do that as town and scum.
2. Devante No major controversies. So what? Has excuse for minimal attendance. So what? He seems to only engage with the game occasionally but that is sort-of his M.O.
3. pmchugh
4. Votanic Confirmed Town. Enough said.
5. Swang918
6. Loose Cannon
7. DirtyDishSoap
8. Kingm Confirmed Town. Enough said.
9. kongming3 Huge gaps in attendance, interspersed with occasional posts that could be interpreted as either townish, scummish, or just plain odd.
10. Sonic *Pixar* Not really confirmed Town, but we're all kinda going with it, because poor Town just doesn't have the bandwidth to deal with Sonic and Scum at the same time.
11. Maxleod
12. Ragian His latest post is either Town-comfirming, ...or else a perfectly deadly scum lie.
Yes, In case you missed it, Ragian received Kingm's second invention.
However!?!? according to Kingm:

I'm just playing with an open hand,I was the town inventor, I gave away town tracker to LC, so that was lost, and I have also given away the roleblock to another player who think is town

So what gives? here?
Ragian, Kingm said he gave you the Roleblock Invention, not the Tracker Invention, so why are you claiming that you tracked devante??

13. Charle Play-style often seems too friendly and helpful to be Scum, ...but this could also easily be an illusion.
14. fusibaseball I went back and read his last big post on Page 27. It's pretty much what I'd want a Townie to play, ...but the sad truth is Scum could also give good analysis with little risk to themselves.
15. Trafalgarlaw01

Frankly, Fusi, Charle, and strike wolf would be a Scum dream team... and so far, all our punishment votes for bad play have just lynched lame townies...
It could even just be two of thoes three with anybody else making up the third. Perhaps we should consider lynching a good-playing Townie...

All that can wait, first Ragian and Kingm need to explain the discrepancy I pointed out above.
I'm not happy with the convoluted way I wrote this post, but hopefully it makes sesne, because it is important.

[SoN!c]

Thank you for that long post, Kong. I didn't follow all of it, ...

LOL Vot!! but yes true i did not either because it was too long, i used my 15 sec scan eyes and i think i got it. Looked very townish..

Then i read this great stuff: "Sonic Not really confirmed Town, but we're all kinda going with it, because poor Town just doesn't have the bandwidth to deal with Sonic and Scum at the same time".

all that to my "Super-Stupid Sonic-Shield" im sure while everybody knows its Pixar Vanilla Sub...

but then the important game stuff was made in insurance typewriting (very small):


Yes, In case you missed it, Ragian received Kingm's second invention.

f*ck Vot?? This has to be

Yes, In case you missed it, Ragian received Kingm's second invention.

[SoN!c]

f*ck Vot,

baffled here so unvote to be sure, my mind is in denial right now - im been ragiading it over and over


Vote Ragian

[SoN!c]

whatever "ragiading" means, i was doing it for full 10 minutes

[SoN!c]

Vote Ragian again in case i missed it

[SoN!c]

Im been saying Ragian - Charle - Fusi since the start i joined practically, im just getting over a scum Ragian idea while he was top suspect to start with and now Vot share's this with rest of town???? While all Vot's votes Swang, Max and whatever were all town hits? Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuckkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk

[SoN!c]

I think "ragiading" means: mind is reading ragian as scum confirmed

[Votanic]

Everybody else, please ignore Sonic's long and excessive excessive series of posts and go back up and read my previous post, especially Ragian and Kingm because an explanation is needed.

[SoN!c]

Everybody else, please ignore Sonic's long and excessive excessive series of posts and go back up and read my previous post, especially Ragian and Kingm because an explanation is needed.

Vot, i like your play. it's like PMC said your not bad at this but you do not like mafia because this game is based on educated guesses and on that part : well you suck. Everything else is top score. Just on educated guesses i always wonder in which country we are.

Just go with "give and take here and there" and consider other players could be right too? At least sometimes.. You have been hitting nothing but town, you voted Swang when you PR knew he did not move N1 and you have kept about anything town needed to know for yourself

[SoN!c]

Whatever you do in life don't take educated guesses Vot. That is not your strong side. Just stick with what you know 100% . Giving advice for a friend

[Votanic]

Sonic's new fail meme: "My friend when he says it's and educated guess"...

Anyway, I await both Ragian's and Kingm's replies.