PYP~Mafia [05/21] end game

[mtamburini]

Will do a post game write up today.

Should be very simple to logic out the last mafia via claims.

Zivel couldnt seem to figure it out

Let me give you some simple advice.

Being on town is being part of a team. We have to work together to work things out, you are good at seeing some of more complex plans and you saw that streaker lynch coming which I didn't understand till the mafia qt.

But where you fail is communicating your knowledge with your team. You come across as arrogant and people are not going to listen to someone who abuses them and treats them like they are stupid.

It does not matter if you have worked out the game in day one if you cannot convey that to the others in your team.

And you are right, my tunneling almost lost it for town. That I will watch for in the future.

But I was every scum lynch except the first.

I dont care what happens in game as it is just a game, when the game ends and you try and be a tough guy by critizing my play when you havent done anything close to productive as what I have thats what I have a problem with.

You took a good approach about it, kill did not.

And hot shot you were a sacrificial lamb, my intentions were you were town but I just needed to know if DJ did take NRA or not

[Killuminati19]

I see you shied away from the real issues I brought up. Typical. If you keep ignoring it, I'm sure it'll be forgotten.

[Killuminati19]

Will do a post game write up today.

Should be very simple to logic out the last mafia via claims.

Zivel couldnt seem to figure it out

Let me give you some simple advice.

Being on town is being part of a team. We have to work together to work things out, you are good at seeing some of more complex plans and you saw that streaker lynch coming which I didn't understand till the mafia qt.

But where you fail is communicating your knowledge with your team. You come across as arrogant and people are not going to listen to someone who abuses them and treats them like they are stupid.

It does not matter if you have worked out the game in day one if you cannot convey that to the others in your team.

And you are right, my tunneling almost lost it for town. That I will watch for in the future.

But I was every scum lynch except the first.

I dont care what happens in game as it is just a game, when the game ends and you try and be a tough guy by critizing my play when you havent done anything close to productive as what I have thats what I have a problem with.

You took a good approach about it, kill did not.

And hot shot you were a sacrificial lamb, my intentions were you were town but I just needed to know if DJ did take NRA or not

It's fun when a guy runs his mouth all game, trying to be an internet tough guy, but when the tables are turned, "it is just a game".

[Killuminati19]

you see kill this is how you make an arguement and give constructive criticism. Zivel helped me and Im helping him. Not whine and bitch like a little cry baby.

And this is how you completely ignore that constructive criticism. As soon as you called him a cry baby, everything else you say is completely worthless. People will not listen to abusive people.

Kills got beef with me because I called him acting scummy one game and he flipped his shit and OMGUS'd me and is still crying about it. Apparently im supposed to read him as town when he dosent do anything

No. Kills had issues with you because you were acting like an egoistical prick. And then you don't even admit it... Take a week or so and go back and reread what you wrote from an independent perspective.... you might see why people are saying that you played badly this game.

Nah I played fine, but if this is the kind of shit I can expect from people in the future lynching me cause you dont like my aggressive style of play and will lynch me regardless of alignment just so I dont play proves what a child you really are kill.

BTW how did that work out for me? I dunno you got me "mislynched" as town when you wouldt look elsewhere and ended up losing the game, so was that my fault too?

You don't get it. It's my fault you got "mislynched"? I'm one vote. You get yourself mislynched. It is 100% on you. You will continue to do so if you don't figure it out. THIS makes you a really bad player.

[strike wolf]

Im not going to talk aboit the Mtam situation. I said what I wanted o say about that. Arguing with him already piled up most of the thread. I want to talk about something else now.

So some players who I feel were important to the gamd. Jw. I was neutral on you early but that was a good use of an cop check. Streaker. Watching the game fom the sidelines. Was really worried you were about to shoot Mtam when Jonty or Legion were better targets. Good shot. Charm. A couple good picks early. Sorry to mislead on mets.

[charm]

Boys, boys, boys!
I thought this was a very fun game.
Some of you need to read beyond the abrasive remarks of others - it's just the style of play some use. Learn to read between the lines or words.

I was very impressed with mafia's play and their roles chosen.
This was one of the most unpredictable games I've seen.

I'm off next week on a cruise, so you won't be seeing me around mafia circles until mid-November.

Have a spooky Halloween!

[mtamburini]

I see you shied away from the real issues I brought up. Typical. If you keep ignoring it, I'm sure it'll be forgotten.

You brought up no logical issues so I choose to ignore it.

Everything youve tried to burn me about Ive already explained in game.

[mtamburini]

Im not going to talk aboit the Mtam situation. I said what I wanted o say about that. Arguing with him already piled up most of the thread. I want to talk about something else now.

So some players who I feel were important to the gamd. Jw. I was neutral on you early but that was a good use of an cop check. Streaker. Watching the game fom the sidelines. Was really worried you were about to shoot Mtam when Jonty or Legion were better targets. Good shot. Charm. A couple good picks early. Sorry to mislead on mets.

He did shoot me, if I wasnt jailed I wouldve died.

[mtamburini]

Read your first paragraph strike, I can go into great detail why I lynched Jwiedlin, it was simple mathematics to keep the game going in a potential mylo situation. There was guarenteed one mafia between Jwiedlin and DD so lynching both would continue the game. With regards to my choice of role, sure I didnt understand it but that was only because I was asking the mod how I could use it and he was ok with what I was asking. Im nto playing Storr for how the role got used but that was just an unfortunate situation. With regards to me killing zivel it was auto confirmed town won the game, it was either zivel or legion so I lynch one of them town lynches the other. GAME OVER.

As per my "bad play" this game, how you guys decide whether or not people are scummy or towny based on only 12-15 page long games is beyond my comprehension. Having someone only post once a day and a day cycle being 1 week how do you expect to get reads? My style of play forces people to talk more often then they want to and help develop reads for the entire game.

[dd515087]

Boys, boys, boys!
I thought this was a very fun game.
Some of you need to read beyond the abrasive remarks of others - it's just the style of play some use. Learn to read between the lines or words.

I was very impressed with mafia's play and their roles chosen.
This was one of the most unpredictable games I've seen.

I'm off next week on a cruise, so you won't be seeing me around mafia circles until mid-November.

Have a spooky Halloween!

Thank you It was my first time being on the mafia side. I feel like we would've won if not for the cop check, damn you JW. Curious why you picked me? I don't know if you already said that or not and I just forgot

[Streaker]

Im not going to talk aboit the Mtam situation. I said what I wanted o say about that. Arguing with him already piled up most of the thread. I want to talk about something else now.

So some players who I feel were important to the gamd. Jw. I was neutral on you early but that was a good use of an cop check. Streaker. Watching the game fom the sidelines. Was really worried you were about to shoot Mtam when Jonty or Legion were better targets. Good shot. Charm. A couple good picks early. Sorry to mislead on mets.

Funny though, because I actually shot Mtam at the previous night.... But was jailkept...
Seriously, MTam, being that defensive really was scummy in my eyes, and with dat claim... I can see from your perspective why, as you will play the same as you are on mafia side I suppose.

Mtam didn't convince me until he was added to Charm's QT network.

On D1 it was obvious, and I think to several players, that DD was scum. That bandwagon so early gave it away.
Also rather obvious that DJ would flip scum for not revealing NRA, though RL issues can indeed always happen.

As for legion... I seriously had no clue. Really. Can someone explain how he acted scummy because I must have completely missed it.

Overall, really interesting concept to play in.

As for my Thief pick: on the Nr10 draft taking a role that alows you to screw with top drafts was fun
I was totally aiming for inventor though...

[Streaker]

Which I totally DONT understand is how can BOTTOM draft take the BEST fucking role in the game? I would have been sure it was top 3, together with NRA.

[Streaker]

STORR

Can you post all actions and Role PM's? Also the draft picks would be a very interesting read.

Thx

[jwiedlin]

Thank you It was my first time being on the mafia side. I feel like we would've won if not for the cop check, damn you JW. Curious why you picked me? I don't know if you already said that or not and I just forgot

It was a tough decision on who to investigate, and I went over all the posts multiple times.

I thought you had made some good points, but your voting record seemed distinctly anti-town from my perspective.

D1: Hotshot
D2: Mtam (per Storr's list, in hindsight, your actual vote appears to be on DJ)
(Day 3 skipped)
D4: Mtam

My main reason for voting for you was the fact that you had not claimed a role, and I was hunting for the Prince of Darkness, and the vote rigger. At this point, we had 11 people alive.

2 mtamburini (claimed cupid)
6 Metsfanmax
7 jonty125
9 legionnare
10 streaker
12 charm
14 dd515087
16 Zivel (claims witch)
17 jwiedlin (Vanilla townie)
20 UltrasPlot (claimed Jail keeper)
21 TheForgivenOne

Once the claimed roles and myself were factored in, there were 7 people left to choose from. I had a suspicion that either charm or TFO were the inventor, so I eliminated them from consideration. Mets had not voted hotshot day 1, so was eliminated from consideration also. I was left with 4 names to decide from to smoke out the prince of darkness or voterigger.

7 jonty125
9 legionnare
10 streaker
14 dd515087

You had already voted for mtam. If you were either cleared as town, or found to be mafia, it would shed light on the mtam situation. I believed mtam was town, so thought you would be a good check. Furthermore, strike wolf cast suspicion on you, and was later proven town. You went so far as to call him out on this. His later death made me question whether or not you had a motive.

I'd also like to note that I am getting a lot of scum vibes from DD515.

I'm offended. Care to elaborate?

I'll admit, it was still a shot in the dark, but I felt we could get most information from a town check on you.

[dd515087]

Damn you put a lot of thought into that one. Good call. Totally ruined our plans. But yeah I pushed for strike's death after that and then streaker's later on. Tried to sneak it in there with the double lynch, but I misjudged the time. You would've been dead N2 (maybe N3 I don't remember) but someone saved you. Had that gone through I think mafia would've won the game

[mtamburini]

you see kill this is how you make an arguement and give constructive criticism. Zivel helped me and Im helping him. Not whine and bitch like a little cry baby.

And this is how you completely ignore that constructive criticism. As soon as you called him a cry baby, everything else you say is completely worthless. People will not listen to abusive people.

Kills got beef with me because I called him acting scummy one game and he flipped his shit and OMGUS'd me and is still crying about it. Apparently im supposed to read him as town when he dosent do anything

No. Kills had issues with you because you were acting like an egoistical prick. And then you don't even admit it... Take a week or so and go back and reread what you wrote from an independent perspective.... you might see why people are saying that you played badly this game.

Nah I played fine, but if this is the kind of shit I can expect from people in the future lynching me cause you dont like my aggressive style of play and will lynch me regardless of alignment just so I dont play proves what a child you really are kill.

BTW how did that work out for me? I dunno you got me "mislynched" as town when you wouldt look elsewhere and ended up losing the game, so was that my fault too?

You don't get it. It's my fault you got "mislynched"? I'm one vote. You get yourself mislynched. It is 100% on you. You will continue to do so if you don't figure it out. THIS makes you a really bad player.

You did really well to carry town that game, *slow claps*

[mtamburini]

Will do a post game write up today.

Should be very simple to logic out the last mafia via claims.

Zivel couldnt seem to figure it out

Let me give you some simple advice.

Being on town is being part of a team. We have to work together to work things out, you are good at seeing some of more complex plans and you saw that streaker lynch coming which I didn't understand till the mafia qt.

But where you fail is communicating your knowledge with your team. You come across as arrogant and people are not going to listen to someone who abuses them and treats them like they are stupid.

It does not matter if you have worked out the game in day one if you cannot convey that to the others in your team.

And you are right, my tunneling almost lost it for town. That I will watch for in the future.

But I was every scum lynch except the first.

I dont care what happens in game as it is just a game, when the game ends and you try and be a tough guy by critizing my play when you havent done anything close to productive as what I have thats what I have a problem with.

You took a good approach about it, kill did not.

And hot shot you were a sacrificial lamb, my intentions were you were town but I just needed to know if DJ did take NRA or not

It's fun when a guy runs his mouth all game, trying to be an internet tough guy, but when the tables are turned, "it is just a game".

Is it not a game? After game you can feel free to discuss anything you want, you coming out saying your so shit and dont give any good reasons that havent already been answered makes me laugh.

[Killuminati19]

The next time you give a coherent answer about selling out me and whatsausage will be the first.

[mtamburini]

The next time you give a coherent answer about selling out me and whatsausage will be the first.

One of you was VT or Vanilla mafia, if mafia wants to get rid of another VT then good for them. IT wasnt going to be a 2 for 1 power role kill. And your only making this assumption now that you know you are both town, one of you could have been mafia and so if the one who was town dies a mafia dies as well so its worth it to out the lovers.

[Killuminati19]

That's wierd. You clearly stated you thought we were both town as you sold us out, and guess what...............WE WERE! So your version of revisionist history says that you thought one of us was mafia? I don't know why that would have been the assumption. It was a stupid move.

[rishaed]

As much as I think that there are some merits to conversation... It has just turned into a long argument that is going nowhere... Could someone maybe archive this? Even though I'm not exactly the person who would ask this normally.

[mtamburini]

That's wierd. You clearly stated you thought we were both town as you sold us out, and guess what...............WE WERE! So your version of revisionist history says that you thought one of us was mafia? I don't know why that would have been the assumption. It was a stupid move.

Thats because you dont understand basic mechanics. That was my assumption I can always be wrong and I wanted to make it clear that everyone knew if 2 people died they would know it was because THOSE 2 people were lovers and there wouldnt be any fake claims available for mafia.

[strike wolf]

Blah blah blah. The fact is that Mtam needed to reveal at least one of you to help verify his role. Maybe revealing two was a bit ill thought but you are blowing this way out of proportion Kill.

[StorrZerg]

STORR

Can you post all actions and Role PM's? Also the draft picks would be a very interesting read.

Thx

yes ill try and get them up tonight


https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... =424524936


Few thoughts.

There should have been more coordination with town on the initial phase. Pretty much 0 strategy was held on what to do. Woulda been nice to see people try to figure things out, maybe having someone demand 1/1 idk.

As far as bans went. Mafia wise, pretty solid can't go wrong with those bans tbh. so ill give that an A.
Town bans. pretty good as well. Hooker isn't worth a ban, can stills crew up mafia, and while it could be crazy to see abunch of townies die, having 1 or 2 mafia die from it would just be disastrous. + its a very unreliable way to secure additional KP. So imo mafia wouldn't want it, so not worth the ban. CPR doc was a great ban, assassin imo is a very good ban. (its basically +1 kp for mafia) Hero ban was a bit meh imo. but it isn't terrible. so i give town bans B

Now this is also the stage where people should be discussing the importance of certain roles. 1st pick should defult to inventor. Its just simply to powerful a role to not have as either alignment. It should be the #1 draft pick regardless of alignment, as it out values all other power roles, because of its creativity. Then from that the top 5 picks should be aiming for "these kind of roles" then so forth. This will help town avoid picking ontop of each other, which happened a little bit, but honestly not that much.

So mafia picks.
NRA, Polician (taken so goon), king maker, vote rigger, Prince of darkness. So right off the bat, mafia has 2 imo poor picks. NRA and PoD. While NRA seems like it is a good pick, denies investigations on you, (you all ready banned the majority of investigative things as well as medics) So its a bit repetitive in needing it for that aspect. Also, if anyone was to out Such role, It instantly makes you look mafia. Cause why would a town keep such a role hidden and risk other townie lives. (generally) Second is Pod. This is also a poor choice given with what you have. You dont have anything to really combo it with. No way to get extra kills, or extra night actions. (the timing of its use in game was also poor, gave town extra abilities in the night) i think if this was used closer to an end game option (force lylo a day earlier etc) its ok. But you need kp for this ability to be effective. The king maker /poli combo seems nice. But in reality, once used on day 1, it points to obviously a mafia combination if used. It is also very reliant on having both poli and king. (mafia ended up getting denied poly, so their combo was severely lacking in kills early on. Vote rigger is pretty solid, great way to sneak kills and kill off someone you feel very threatening. So i give the mafia team picks C+.

Djfireside NRA member -- Over valued (as said above)
mtamburini cupid --- (way over valued, picked for the lulz/troll)
HotShot53 NRA member -- (i assume it was picked to insure that a town had it, and he would have claimed he had it if he got it, so decent pick)
Killuminati19 Vigilante (solid pick, deny mafia kp role, how ever it would have been 1 step better to take the JOAT since you still get 2 kp with that option, and additional powers)
virus90 politician (i feel this pick is over valued for this spot, how ever it did deny a mafia. a key power. )
Metsfanmax Politician (decent try for mafia to take the combo, second highest tried, slightly out beat)
jonty125 King maker (good spot for the pick considering)
grt Extractor (excellent pick, this is also a very solid mafia pick, combo with with assassin and its pretty deadly. helps to insure claims and can keep the claims somewhat hidden since extractor doesn't have to announce they used the ability)
legionnare Vote rigger (solid mafia pick for the spot imo)
streaker Thief (good pick maybe over valued)
crasp [3][17] 11 copycat (ok pick, over valued i think)
charm recruiting mason (over valued for the spot. Good "town minded" pick )
Whatsausage bomber man (i dont see much use of this role for a town. meh value imo)
dd515087 Prince of Darkness (terrible pick considering the other picks mafia had)
aage floridian (ok pick for how far down he was in the picks. )
Zivel witch (very solid pick for the position,)
jwiedlin Copy cat (good pick for the spot, was taken though)
pancakemix Parity Cop (i think this pick should have been valued more, considering what limited detective roles. so great grab for this spot)
strike wolf Thief (good choice for this position imo, theif is also a very solid mafia pick since you can deny a town their role, combos well with assasin)
Iron Butterfly/ UltrasPlot jail keeper (really good pick for the spot, rb and protection. really townie role as well)
TheForgivenOne inventor (most valued pick for the position on the draft)


So ill review a few roles that i think should have made it in the game that didnt. INVENTOR BEING LAST PICK IS INSANE AND NEARLY NOT PICKED.

anyways..
role cop isn't bad. you are denied a normal cop, but finding a very "townie" role or a very "mafia" role can help to find alignment.
Veteran, would have been great for a lower pick imo, very town sided role and allows one to be very aggresive about controlling town.
rock starr (shits hilarious)
Day vig. Pretty town role. only 1 use though
AMERICA AND RUSSIA cause nukes "yeah"
Assassin for mafia. very surprised it wasn't picked.
bad santa, can be good. pretty much a town role
Capitalist, great for mafia. combos well with assasin. (3 role checks + 1 kp) decent town too
JOAT 100% should have had more value on. vig/day vig, DETECTIVE, medic, bulletproof options pretty good.
Pardoner great to use to counter vote rigger.
Emperor pretty solid, extra lynch + kill someone that pisses you off early who can't win with this
Janitor after several town deaths is pretty crazy. solid pick but needs kp from mafia to pull off.

well those are a few roles that i think should have had more priority in no particular order.

[Streaker]

I was absolutely convinced that Inventor would be in the top 3. My whole Thief power was based on taking Inventor. Damn I wanted that role so bad.
Simply unbelievable that it was the LAST pick, and the shere ballz for picking inventor on LAST draft lol.

This game was overshadowed by the sheer number of modkills, maybe Storr is a little too strict on this? I don't know.
Very fun game, never played with these amount of roles before.

Thank you for the experience.