Conquer Club

wolvenlightning wrote:1) what does the sumatra thing have to do with anything

2) If out of 5 games, 2 of them have had these bad streaks, that should count more than someone who's played 100 games and had 2 games with that kind of luck. Look at the percentages

3) Ignore the references to the games themselves and look at the rest of the points. The fact that I've only played 2 games doesn't make a bit of difference if other people also witness bad streaks

4) The solutions are left to the creators to fix. I'm pointing out issues, not solving them... I'm not getting paid

just a joke....and the creators do not see a problem, and bad streaks are a part of the game....it there were no streaks...and the dice were win-lose-win-lose-win-lose....they would not be random....and....like i say....there are no better dice......these are the ones you have to play with...do you see people with 1000 plus games saying they should be changed????

i wouldnt mind if i didnt lose 10 in a row, but seeing as a random dice generator delivers the dice in batches of 100000 at a time....im prepared to live with what they offer...and you are using the few hundred dice as an example against the 70000 ive thrown on here and multiple sites.....streaks happen everywhere...its part of a random system...

and no one is really trying to prove anything here....were saying they are random enough, beware of possible streaks...and enjoy the game....even if the dice are way off, the creators of the site dont make them up, and make no guarantees they will treat you fairly...

in any case.....enjoy the game either way

wolvenlightning wrote:what are you trying to do, filibuster him?



Anyway, I agree with you, regardless of what other people are saying. I'm not sure what they use to program the dice, but it's now been two games (out of two completed and three active) where my starting positions have been decimated because I attacked and lost all my troops.



For the people who like to post useless replies, this never happens to me when I play offline games that involve dice, so stop trying to compensate for your personal shortcomings and just go to a different topic if you don't like the one being discussed

Thats my original post... Notice that I never said I expected them to fix it. Nor did I say I was going to boycott the game because of it. I was just explaining what's happened to me in my short experience here and at the same time attack the idiocy of people who spam topics with stupid replies just because they don't agree with what's being discussed.


Fitz, there is a difference between 'random enough' and 'perfectly random', and I do agree that they're random enough. Still, if you get the short end of the stick, you're entitled to whine about it, and I felt like doing that at the time.

So, if you're going to debate with me whether or not the dice are 'random enough', don't, because I agreed they are.



Disk, the point is that I don't need to prove nearly as much to be right as you do. All I have to do is point out a single instance and I'm automatically right - I'm saying the system isn't perfect, not that it's completely corrupt. You meanwhile are trying to tell me there's not a single instance of pattern in the entire history of the dice for this game. Ergo, I'm poking holes in your arguments, not making a separate one.

ok....and we're telling you they may be fine....

i post in these to let people know the dice are fine, so they dont get frustrated...

and dont think we are attacking you...we know its frustrating, so we let you know everything is fine or close enough to it so you dont think you were cheated in some way....

when i first started, i thought there might even be cheating with the dice, but now i know better....

mk, thats fine. if you're just bitching about the dice, no one should flame you because we all do it. but when you cross over and start talking about flaws, your limited experience warrants an inferno.

Install Dice Analyzer

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5655

Play 20 games and take a look at the Dice Analyzer. You'll feel better when you do. If you don't feel better, post a screen shot of your Dice Analyzer and we will be able to see what you're talking about.

Until then it's kind of a nebulous discussion.

kclborat wrote:Actually FlickFlack, CC uses random.org, which is a true random number site. It uses the outside source of entropy of radio waves on an empty frequency.

So it's better than the standard. Wonderful. If I was bitching about how the numbers aren't really random, you would have put me in my place.

wow. you guys are crazy. i leave here for 2 days and its already a crazy mess. i never actually thought that my angry frustrated rant would warrant such a hot discussion. but it was fun reading all the posts anyway.

p.s. i tried the chili ... it was excellent.

no, i wasn't bitching at you, FlickFlack, i was giving helpful outside knowledge, thats all. no offense intended.

kclborat wrote:no, i wasn't bitching at you, FlickFlack, i was giving helpful outside knowledge, thats all. no offense intended.

Heh, it's all cool.

kclborat wrote:Ok, but, there are players here who have been here for almost a year. And bad and good rolls happen to them. But I am sure you've played in at least one game where you won against a lot and lost few if any troops. You just forgot about it.

PS The dice rolls are created using truly random numbers, which means that since they use an outside source of entropy, the rolls are not predictable.

"truly random"?

also...the dice appear one sided, because the programing for the 3D ones took up too much memory

i dont agree with yo AA for the reason i play late at night when very few are on and the dice still suck.

I refuse to deadbeat but the die are the reason i will stop playing on cc, only 18 games left to finish.

gerry22 wrote:I refuse to deadbeat but the die are the reason i will stop playing on cc, only 18 games left to finish.

Nonsense. Get the dice analyzer, and you'll see the dice are almost perfectly random. In fact, according to my results, out of over 15,000 rolls, defenders tend to roll slightly more 1's than would be expected on average.

Stopper wrote:Nonsense. Get the dice analyzer, and you'll see the dice are almost perfectly random. In fact, according to my results, out of over 15,000 rolls,

Well, the problem would be is that you need 15k rolls to get such randomness.

I had perfect randomness as well over 15k rolls before I accidentally deleted the cookie for Dice Analyzer the other day.

So, starting fresh, here's what I've done the last couple of days:

1s 308 / 1785 (17.25%) 127 / 877 (14.48%)
2s 289 / 1785 (16.19%) 132 / 877 (15.05%)
3s 337 / 1785 (18.88%) 154 / 877 (17.56%)
4s 292 / 1785 (16.36%) 166 / 877 (18.93%)
5s 285 / 1785 (15.97%) 148 / 877 (16.88%)
6s 274 / 1785 (15.35%) 150 / 877 (17.1%)

Battle Outcomes Actual Stats Ideal Stats
3v2 68 / 79 / 90 (28.69% / 33.33% / 37.97%) (37.17% / 33.58% / 29.26%)
3v1 209 / 111 (65.31% / 34.69%) (65.97% / 34.03%)

Yeah, I'm dropping games right now because I can't get squat done.

And this is basically the same kind of situation I had when I first started using Dice Analyzer several weeks back. I start out 'in the red' in terms of even or dice stats in my favor.

And it took TEN THOUSAND rolls for the dice to approach normalization.

At about the 5000 roll mark point, I'd rolled over 120 less 6's than 1's. That may not sound like a lot, but it means my stats were more than 2% off normalization. That should not happen over that many rolls.

It takes a lot of time and a lot of games to make up for a streak of bad rolls.

gerry22 wrote:I refuse to deadbeat but the die are the reason i will stop playing on cc, only 18 games left to finish.

feel free to leave of course, but remember everyone gets the same dice, so if your losing you have one person to blame

Stopper wrote:

gerry22 wrote:I refuse to deadbeat but the die are the reason i will stop playing on cc, only 18 games left to finish.

Nonsense. Get the dice analyzer, and you'll see the dice are almost perfectly random. In fact, according to my results, out of over 15,000 rolls, defenders tend to roll slightly more 1's than would be expected on average.

I'm sick hearing this trite rubbish about the dice analyzer. I'll not stress this again, It's "practically Useless". Die statistics need to be broken down into far more precise objects than what is done already.

how many 6's are throw from defenders die?
how many 5's are throw from defenders die?
how often?
Broken down into individual games?
Consecutive wins/losses?

Come On!

IF i was cheating you by "rigging" the die your "dice statistics" would still average out AND the dice analyzer wouldn't show you that i was cheating you, right? Because how often would you play me.

IF lower ranks had better odds Or stronger die than higher ranks, again the die statistics would average out. Why would someone do such an idiotic, ridiculous thing. Work that one out for yourself.

It looks the part and gives the impression of usefulness but really it's just like all the shit in the cupboard under the stairs, crap you don't need.

AAFitz wrote:

gerry22 wrote:I refuse to deadbeat but the die are the reason i will stop playing on cc, only 18 games left to finish.

feel free to leave of course, but remember everyone gets the same dice, so if your losing you have one person to blame

Only 15 games to go.

gerry22 wrote:how many 6's are throw from defenders die?
how many 5's are throw from defenders die?
how often?
Broken down into individual games?
Consecutive wins/losses?

You may think it's "trite rubbish", but given that the analyzer actually answers the first THREE of your questions, I think you either haven't looked at the thing properly, or more likely, you haven't even downloaded it in the first place.

The remaining questions are irrelevant, because giving any credence to the idea that the dice could possibly be "loaded" in any other way, such as favouring lower ranks, would require a bizarre level of paranoia on your part.

If you really are so convinced the dice are loaded - which the fact that you have answered so vigorously would indicate that you ARE - why don't you spend your time more usefully and write an analyzer of your own?

Good day. Twat.

Rubbish!

You don't need to win too many dice rolls to when this game! Good knowledge of where and when to attack make up ten times more for good dice. I would wager that a good player can win a game without needing to when more than 1/2 the rolls. A great player can do it with even crappier dice.

Don't blame tha dice if YOU can't win!

GrazingCattle wrote:Don't blame tha dice if YOU can't win!

I'll say it before, and I'll say it again: you can be the greatest strategist in the world, but you won't win a game if you don't get some luck with the dice.

Or do you think you can win (aside from your opponents going deadbeat) if you never win a roll?

You won't NEVER win a roll. Good players find a way to win even against bad odds. that was my point!

GrazingCattle wrote:Good players find a way to win even against bad odds. that was my point!

Then I believe you're a bit naive as to how much luck vs strategy is needed in Risk (or many other similar games).

I guess you have never heard of Sun Tzu. He believed you needed strong planning, strong position, and strong tactics. Diplomacy also plays a part. Only attack where you are assured victory. Never Assult where you can't win. Simple but important truths that have little to do with Luck.

I believe you make you choice, and at times the dice gods say NO! and then you die. You still don't lose every match because the dice are bad.

You lose because you choose the wrong place and/or time to attack!