Conquer Club

aage wrote:

Epitaph1 wrote:I don't think the orc died with the dragon. The only people dead from the scene are the dragon and 2 people who got endgamed. The janitor may know 3 identities now, so the fakeclaims are piling up. At least greg claimed, so that's not available to the janitor/mafia.

Then why didn't the dragon show up as unknown? It would be very much in the mafia's favor if town thought the CL was still alive.

Because the dragon was already cult confirmed by TFO? So any scene where the dragon died wouldn't be of any help because town would still know that the dragon was dead, ergo cult was dead.

rishaed wrote:

aage wrote:

Epitaph1 wrote:I don't think the orc died with the dragon. The only people dead from the scene are the dragon and 2 people who got endgamed. The janitor may know 3 identities now, so the fakeclaims are piling up. At least greg claimed, so that's not available to the janitor/mafia.

Then why didn't the dragon show up as unknown? It would be very much in the mafia's favor if town thought the CL was still alive.

Because the dragon was already cult confirmed by TFO? So any scene where the dragon died wouldn't be of any help because town would still know that the dragon was dead, ergo cult was dead.

Assuming that was the only dragon in the game.

strike wolf wrote:

rishaed wrote:

aage wrote:

Epitaph1 wrote:I don't think the orc died with the dragon. The only people dead from the scene are the dragon and 2 people who got endgamed. The janitor may know 3 identities now, so the fakeclaims are piling up. At least greg claimed, so that's not available to the janitor/mafia.

Then why didn't the dragon show up as unknown? It would be very much in the mafia's favor if town thought the CL was still alive.

Because the dragon was already cult confirmed by TFO? So any scene where the dragon died wouldn't be of any help because town would still know that the dragon was dead, ergo cult was dead.

Assuming that was the only dragon in the game.

sure, but a dragons are rare, and have two cults in the game of 19 players would make the game highly unbalanced. which would be unfeasible in an official game.

rishaed wrote:

strike wolf wrote:

rishaed wrote:

aage wrote:

Epitaph1 wrote:I don't think the orc died with the dragon. The only people dead from the scene are the dragon and 2 people who got endgamed. The janitor may know 3 identities now, so the fakeclaims are piling up. At least greg claimed, so that's not available to the janitor/mafia.

Then why didn't the dragon show up as unknown? It would be very much in the mafia's favor if town thought the CL was still alive.

Because the dragon was already cult confirmed by TFO? So any scene where the dragon died wouldn't be of any help because town would still know that the dragon was dead, ergo cult was dead.

Assuming that was the only dragon in the game.

sure, but a dragons are rare, and have two cults in the game of 19 players would make the game highly unbalanced. which would be unfeasible in an official game.

Assuming the second dragon would also be cult.

Indeed, assuming. But since the first one was I would assume the second one would be also? Not extremely familiar with D&D alignments.

My understanding (I have not played D&D just read a bit about it) is that dragons come in multiple different varieties, so no not necessarily the same alignment as the first dragon, let alone a similar role.

rishaed wrote:

aage wrote:

Epitaph1 wrote:I don't think the orc died with the dragon. The only people dead from the scene are the dragon and 2 people who got endgamed. The janitor may know 3 identities now, so the fakeclaims are piling up. At least greg claimed, so that's not available to the janitor/mafia.

Then why didn't the dragon show up as unknown? It would be very much in the mafia's favor if town thought the CL was still alive.

Because the dragon was already cult confirmed by TFO? So any scene where the dragon died wouldn't be of any help because town would still know that the dragon was dead, ergo cult was dead.

TFO could have lied. TFO could be a cult lackey for all we know. He could have bluffed his way through this stuff. Whichever it is, the mod cannot ever confirm someone's claim in a scene this specifically while ignoring such an important role as janitor.

I have the off feeling you know more about this janitor mechanic than the rest of us. FoS.

anamainiacks wrote:post

So you weren't aware that I jailed you last night? Interesting.

aage wrote:

rishaed wrote:

aage wrote:

Epitaph1 wrote:I don't think the orc died with the dragon. The only people dead from the scene are the dragon and 2 people who got endgamed. The janitor may know 3 identities now, so the fakeclaims are piling up. At least greg claimed, so that's not available to the janitor/mafia.

Then why didn't the dragon show up as unknown? It would be very much in the mafia's favor if town thought the CL was still alive.

Because the dragon was already cult confirmed by TFO? So any scene where the dragon died wouldn't be of any help because town would still know that the dragon was dead, ergo cult was dead.

TFO could have lied. TFO could be a cult lackey for all we know. He could have bluffed his way through this stuff. Whichever it is, the mod cannot ever confirm someone's claim in a scene this specifically while ignoring such an important role as janitor.

Was going to post what aage said too. The mod wouldn't ignore the Janitor mechanic (if that is indeed what is happening) just because of the claim of a player in the game. He cannot confirm a claim unless he is supposed to.

aage wrote:

anamainiacks wrote:post

So you weren't aware that I jailed you last night? Interesting.

That is correct.

The ???s are rather confusing. I'm seeing a lot of people jumping to conclusions (especially Rishaed) on the scene. We need to keep track of what is certain.

1 - Recruiter is killed.
2 - 2 ???s were endgamed, unlike NG that was simply killed.

I assume that the cultists were endgamed and that is the reason of those ???s. If NG was also a cultist, then cult started with 2 members (because there were only 2 nights and 3 ???s) and that would explain the ???s, but we can't really confirm that or anything else. That considered, I suggest we focus on standard scumhunting.

From that original off-thread post that said scum would probably be LE/NEs (and it definitely feels like it since the Jonty lynch scene implies he could have been saved by speaking the truth about his CN alignment), 3 feels like the right number for mafia if we consider that town already has to fight itself (Lawfuls vs. Chaotics). I also consider MoB cleared from having an evil alignment, since the recruiter's death means the Saf/MoB relation is legit. With Yoshi, that's 2 confirmed non-evil players. We can go from there.

TheForgivenOne wrote:On a side note...

*Glances at aage*

Since Aage seems to have targeted Anam, could you explain the glance?

strike wolf wrote:My understanding (I have not played D&D just read a bit about it) is that dragons come in multiple different varieties, so no not necessarily the same alignment as the first dragon, let alone a similar role.

IIRC alignment is determined by the colour of the dragon. I think Yoshi even mentioned that at some point.

well this is great news that we nailed the cult (well mafia, I assume did). And I am pretty sure the 2 people endgamed were cultees since when edoc mod-killed betiko he revealed his entire role.

I am still unsure of why they are left as ???/??? for the alignments, apart from possibly throwing everyone off on numbers.

I do agree that this now becomes a more standard game, but people just need to know who they win with. which will cause some major issues when votes start to really roll in.

Rodion wrote:

TheForgivenOne wrote:On a side note...

*Glances at aage*

Since Aage seems to have targeted Anam, could you explain the glance?

Hmmm, I think you can guess. But I probably jumped to conclusions.

TheForgivenOne wrote:

Rodion wrote:

TheForgivenOne wrote:On a side note...

*Glances at aage*

Since Aage seems to have targeted Anam, could you explain the glance?

Hmmm, I think you can guess. But I probably jumped to conclusions.

Meaning you're suggesting that you were blocked by other means? That means our 'mafia' have a roleblocker? After all I don't think a 'town' would still insist on blocking TFO; at least not at this point. Or TFO could also be lying, of course.

yea, we cannot really read too much into a train of actions like that. too many variables.

anamainiacks wrote:

TheForgivenOne wrote:

Rodion wrote:

TheForgivenOne wrote:On a side note...

*Glances at aage*

Since Aage seems to have targeted Anam, could you explain the glance?

Hmmm, I think you can guess. But I probably jumped to conclusions.

Meaning you're suggesting that you were blocked by other means? That means our 'mafia' have a roleblocker? After all I don't think a 'town' would still insist on blocking TFO; at least not at this point. Or TFO could also be lying, of course.

I didn't block TFO again because I knew he wasn't the recruiter. From the pool of possible CL's I picked you. Seems like the mafia had a better hunch. No matter, it clears you from having executed the scum kill.

So at least that clears an. partially (not completely), The question is that with everything going on I might go back to the list we compiled for the CL to hunt for scum if the warring Lawful/Chaotic (MoB/Doom) don't kill each other first. Unless someone has complete information that they are witholding on another cult, then I think that scum are the last thing that will hold the splittering town alliances.

aage wrote:

anamainiacks wrote:

TheForgivenOne wrote:

Rodion wrote:

TheForgivenOne wrote:On a side note...

*Glances at aage*

Since Aage seems to have targeted Anam, could you explain the glance?

Hmmm, I think you can guess. But I probably jumped to conclusions.

Meaning you're suggesting that you were blocked by other means? That means our 'mafia' have a roleblocker? After all I don't think a 'town' would still insist on blocking TFO; at least not at this point. Or TFO could also be lying, of course.

I didn't block TFO again because I knew he wasn't the recruiter. From the pool of possible CL's I picked you. Seems like the mafia had a better hunch. No matter, it clears you from having executed the scum kill.

I should have guessed. My original thought was a JOAT that didn't trust me. Not surprised I was blocked again, I feel like i'm painting a bunch of bullseyes on my body.

rishaed wrote:So at least that clears an. partially (not completely), The question is that with everything going on I might go back to the list we compiled for the CL to hunt for scum if the warring Lawful/Chaotic (MoB/Doom) don't kill each other first. Unless someone has complete information that they are witholding on another cult, then I think that scum are the last thing that will hold the splittering town alliances.

The lawful/chaotic war is unimportant to town. Fight it out on your own time.

I understand the doom/mob thing but should they not be more worried about killing evil people first?

dazza2008 wrote:I understand the doom/mob thing but should they not be more worried about killing evil people first?

Except that Yoshi can win with the Lawful Evil, and so I'm guessing that isn't quite as high on his list of priorities.

anamainiacks wrote:

dazza2008 wrote:I understand the doom/mob thing but should they not be more worried about killing evil people first?

Except that Yoshi can win with the Lawful Evil, and so I'm guessing that isn't quite as high on his list of priorities.

Still has to kill the regular evil first. And in scum hunting, I doubt we will specifically find lawful or neutral amongst the evil. If someone claims lawful/evil, Doom can do what he wants but I doubt lawful has the upper hand so the majority will still lynch law/evil.

I haven't much time but I looked at the past 15ish pages for clues, mostly been looking into Rishaed based on this post:

rishaed wrote:

strike wolf wrote:Either way I am personally inclined to trust the claim

After consideration it is a useful role to have, however with the cult leader still in the open it could turn very nasty if either A. Gregwolf was recruited B. Aage gets recruited in the night. We need some form of check to make sure that aage does not get recruited in the night. A busdriver possibly? Either that or we hit the cult recruiter tonight by chance... That would be very fortunate....

Might be a slip, might be just town rooting for town. But if you look at the last wagons (Saf, me, Stubbs), notice how Rish has been amongst the last to vote yet the first to unvote. His play is very careful, doesn't want to get his hands dirty. Also explains why he hasn't contributed much of note to any case ever. Adding that up to the janitor-discussion from earlier this day, I will vote Rishaed so we can finally leave the hypothetical-theme-discussion and kick this day off.

I suspect that Commander blocked TFO. We had already cleared TFO from being the recruiter given that aage jailed him on N1 and the cult had the most reason to keep him in check given that he started with some info about the cult. I'm sure greg was the watcher as he said since he claimed D1 and wasn't aligned with cult at that point. Although, I suppose it could have been someone who still didn't trust TFO, but it's hard to say for sure.

Re: rishaed. I have to go back re-read his wagons and case contributions.

aage wrote:I haven't much time but I looked at the past 15ish pages for clues, mostly been looking into Rishaed based on this post:

rishaed wrote:

strike wolf wrote:Either way I am personally inclined to trust the claim

After consideration it is a useful role to have, however with the cult leader still in the open it could turn very nasty if either A. Gregwolf was recruited B. Aage gets recruited in the night. We need some form of check to make sure that aage does not get recruited in the night. A busdriver possibly? Either that or we hit the cult recruiter tonight by chance... That would be very fortunate....

Might be a slip, might be just town rooting for town. But if you look at the last wagons (Saf, me, Stubbs), notice how Rish has been amongst the last to vote yet the first to unvote. His play is very careful, doesn't want to get his hands dirty. Also explains why he hasn't contributed much of note to any case ever. Adding that up to the janitor-discussion from earlier this day, I will vote Rishaed so we can finally leave the hypothetical-theme-discussion and kick this day off.

That part. It wouldn't matter eitherway, how am I supposed to know what goes on in the night considering that that was mid-day and most night decisions are made somewhere near the end of the day or night for most factions? Now on the other hand it was very fortunate that cult is gone(?). I haven't had much time right now to post extremely long or elaborate cases recently on my own either due to RL unfortunately, so don't read too much into it. Which also would go for contributing for the most part. I do apologize for that however...

I know all about cases based on slips of tongue. Every now and then I am right about them too.

This one on rishaed seems a stretch.

I have also been wanting to vote rishaed, since I don't like the post-scene clutter he filled up the thread with. It was explained in 1 post why it is unlikely that there is a janitor, and then he spent nearly a whole page trying to make the proof fit into his janitor pudding.

vote rishaed

for not wanting to challenge his preconceived notions of the game. Are they preconceived because they are mafiastic?

DoomYoshi wrote:I know all about cases based on slips of tongue. Every now and then I am right about them too.

This one on rishaed seems a stretch.

I have also been wanting to vote rishaed, since I don't like the post-scene clutter he filled up the thread with. It was explained in 1 post why it is unlikely that there is a janitor, and then he spent nearly a whole page trying to make the proof fit into his janitor pudding.

vote rishaed

for not wanting to challenge his preconceived notions of the game. Are they preconceived because they are mafiastic?

Then, how else would you explain why some roles have been given and other roles are in ??? format? It was just the only thing that makes sense to me. I am willing to drop it, but seriously speaking can you think of another role/reason on why the two would be different? Because if you can give me a decent explanation I am more than willing to consider it. I just haven't been given any other options to consider.