Conquer Club

If you have eternal happyness then your mood never goes up or down. Without sadness how can you know what happyness is? Without bad there is no good is frequently said by religious people to say why bad things happen. So how is eternal happyness any better than eternal pain?

The difference is I am level 9 and you are a Noob.

One tastes better.

pmchugh wrote:If you have eternal happyness then your mood never goes up or down. Without sadness how can you know what happyness is? Without bad there is no good is frequently said by religious people to say why bad things happen. So how is eternal happyness any better than eternal pain?

You're kidding right? Please tell me you are not serious. What is the difference between black and white, hot and cold, fast or slow, fat or skinny, and I could go on and on and on....

Pain is what you feel when you burn your hand on a hot stove...happiness is when you eat the awesome food cooked on that hot stove.

Need anymore examples?...sheesh....

keyborn wrote:

pmchugh wrote:If you have eternal happyness then your mood never goes up or down. Without sadness how can you know what happyness is? Without bad there is no good is frequently said by religious people to say why bad things happen. So how is eternal happyness any better than eternal pain?

You're kidding right? Please tell me you are not serious. What is the difference between black and white, hot and cold, fast or slow, fat or skinny, and I could go on and on and on....

Pain is what you feel when you burn your hand on a hot stove...happiness is when you eat the awesome food cooked on that hot stove.

Need anymore examples?...sheesh....

Yup but if you feel it for an infinite amount of time it is "bland".

If you have always had your hand on the stove how would you know that it feels bad to have your hand on it?

pmchugh wrote:

keyborn wrote:

pmchugh wrote:If you have eternal happyness then your mood never goes up or down. Without sadness how can you know what happyness is? Without bad there is no good is frequently said by religious people to say why bad things happen. So how is eternal happyness any better than eternal pain?

You're kidding right? Please tell me you are not serious. What is the difference between black and white, hot and cold, fast or slow, fat or skinny, and I could go on and on and on....

Pain is what you feel when you burn your hand on a hot stove...happiness is when you eat the awesome food cooked on that hot stove.

Need anymore examples?...sheesh....

Yup but if you feel it for an infinite amount of time it is "bland".

If you have always had your hand on the stove how would you know that it feels bad to have your hand on it?

I think if there is a god he loves his people. I do not think that god would create a place such a hell.

I think a HUMAN BEING found a way to scare people and get them to hand their money over and join campaigns and kill, virtually an endless charybdis of possible scenarios, just waiting to twist faith the way they see fit. dont listen to others, listen to yourself. If you conclude there is an invisible man in the sky, so be it. just dont teach in a school, k?

The way I see it, there are probably 6 billion bwelievers on the earth. given that no 2 people can think exactly alike, there are probably, if you go with this, 6 billion plus gods flying around in the sky. just ask them, they will tell you "no, my god wouldnt do that" and the other person that agrees with the other 99.9% on everything about god, says "yes my god would do that".

I would say the difference between Heaven and Hell is all about perception. The worst type of Hell is one where you really believe you are in Heaven. Does that make sense? It's like being in love with someone and they never return that love. At one moment you think you are in Heaven and then all of a sudden you understand...that Heaven and Hell are both the same thing and it all depends on perspective.

In CreeperWienerism, when a soul dies, it first goes to Hell. While in Hell, the soul takes on the shape of a Dungeon And Dragons-style Larvae. A Larvae is a stubby, bloated half-Humanoid/half-giant maggot (kind of like a Centaur but without legs). The Larvae slowly crawls upon the Road Of Pain. The Road Of Pain is a road made of the bones of tormented souls and it leads through the 9 layers of Hell.

As the Larvae travels this road, it is tormented by numerous Devils. These Devils enslave Larvae into their armies to fight the Eternal Blood War between the Devils and the Demons for control over the Abyss.

Now, Larvae have a unique feature, although they feel tremendous amounts of pain, they can heal very quickly...so they are harder than Hell (forgive the pun) to kill. If a Larvae kills 6 souls, it becomes an imp. And again, if this imp kills 12 souls it becomes a Bearded Devil...each Infernal evolution occurs using that formula(6;6+6;6+6+6...etc) or if an Arch-Fiend (such as Beezelbub or Asmodeus) decides to promote a fiendling devil. It is quite possible that an Arch-Fiend would use a lesser devil to perform quests or tasks, of which the promise (upon completion) would be a reward of a new devilish form and power!

If a Larvae dies, it oozes into the Road Of Pain...but the Larvae appears again at the start (kind of like a really bad Monopoly game), however, if a Devil (imp or higher) dies upon the Road...it is dead and it's bones are put to good use (either paving the Road or building fiendish citadels for Fiend Lords). So, if you ever get a promotion in Hell, make sure you don't get killed after that, otherwise it's GAME OVER!

Now, at the end of the Road Of Pain is the Citadel Of Torment. This is a giant iron cube located at the center of the 9th layer of Hell. Here rules the great Asmodeus, Devil Lord of all the Hells.

When a Devil or Larvae enter here, they will go through the most torturous trials throughout the 13 levels of the Citadel. If you can make it through all 13 torments, a gate will open through the Mirror Of A Thousand Infernos and allow you to step into Heaven, where you grow feathery wings and fly around in the clouds and play guitar and drink beer.

So, the lesson here is that you must first go through HELL to ultimately get to your Heaven.

The End.

pmchugh wrote:If you have eternal happyness then your mood never goes up or down. Without sadness how can you know what happyness is? Without bad there is no good is frequently said by religious people to say why bad things happen. So how is eternal happyness any better than eternal pain?

My my, that's a very lovely straw man you have there. First of all it’s happiness (a state of well-being characterized by relative permanence, by dominantly agreeable emotion ranging in value from mere contentment to deep and intense joy in living, and by a natural desire for its continuation). Second of all, all attempts to describe heaven or hell result in a straw man definition, since neither you nor I have been there.

There is an old joke about heaven and hell. In hell everyone is seated at a table with bowls of rice in front of them, but their chopsticks are so long they can’t stretch out their arms long enough to grab the rice from their bowls, never mind bringing the rice to their lips. In heaven, everyone is seated at a table with bowls of rice in front of them and the same chopsticks but they are all happy because they all feed each other.

Paul, who was probably as clueless as we are, writes about this uncertainty of full understanding in the present when he writes, “At present we see indistinctly, as in a mirror, but then face to face. At present I know partially; then I shall know fully, as I am fully known.” Remember that back then mirrors weren’t these perfect silvered backings on perfectly formed panes of glass.

Thus the question of “happiness” is the wrong one; the real question is love, for God is love, and we, being like Him because we see Him as He is, would be of reciprocating love, not just to God but for each other. Is this not agreeable? Is this not contentment? Is this not intense joy? Is this not a good state of being? And not to be in that state; sucks.

Is this trolling or do people really believe the difference between a back rub and sunburn is simply perspective?

2dimes wrote:Is this trolling or do people really believe the difference between a back rub and sunburn is simply perspective?

I guess some people actually see it as that, according to this thread.

pmchugh wrote:If you have eternal happyness then your mood never goes up or down. Without sadness how can you know what happyness is? Without bad there is no good is frequently said by religious people to say why bad things happen. So how is eternal happyness any better than eternal pain?

Despite what some others say, I think this is a valid question. It points out the ridiculousness of the traditional cartoon image of Heaven: sitting around on clouds with harps. Sounds awful boring to me.

Suppose that a child in the womb could observe its own development and theorize about it. She would likely think. "I am developing eyes, so I must be going somewhere that there is light and things to see. I am developing feet so I must be going somewhere that I will have to walk around. I am developing hands, so I must be going someplace where there are things to grasp, and work and play to do with them." and so on.

We spend a lifetime, however long that is, learning, and hopefully developing wisdom and character, for what? Just in time to not need them anymore if there is no Heaven, or if it is just some dormant state. As Shaw says, "Youth is wasted on young people"

Reading between the lines of some passages in the Bible (I assume you direct this question at those of us who read and believe it) indicates that there will be something to do; a family business for which the Father is raising sons and daughters. Whatever it is will demand the wisdom and character the we have developed, and we will be doing it in the manifest presence and close relationship of God, who as tzor mentioned, is love.

1st John 3:2 -- Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when he appears,we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is.

Does that help any, p-mack?

tzor wrote:
There is an old joke about heaven and hell. In hell everyone is seated at a table with bowls of rice in front of them, but their chopsticks are so long they can’t stretch out their arms long enough to grab the rice from their bowls, never mind bringing the rice to their lips. In heaven, everyone is seated at a table with bowls of rice in front of them and the same chopsticks but they are all happy because they all feed each other.

I like this. Never heard it before. A good story.

daddy1gringo wrote:Despite what some others say, I think this is a valid question. It points out the ridiculousness of the traditional cartoon image of Heaven: sitting around on clouds with harps. Sounds awful boring to me.

There is an irony in that a lot of my thoughts on heaven are based on Star Trek. Unfortunately, they never managed to combine the threads in the series itself; a pity.

Before I go there, however, I just want to make an observation. We can get confused with the scientific understanding of people thousands of years ago when we say that God is in the “heavens.” They thought the universe at the time was a sphere or dome surrounded by water. God was outside His creation, as it were. If we view the universe today as a space time continuum, then God is outside space time. There is an implication of this in terms of time itself, because what we call time is simply a dimension within our own universe. What is outside our universe is truly unknown.

There are two models of the immortal in Star Trek. The “Q” were the perfect example of the linear infinity immortality that has been our traditional vision of heaven and hell. In the end they went crazy over infinite boredom and ended their own immortality.

A model that is closer to the traditional description of God (one who just simply is) was found in the wormhole immortals. Unlike the Q who lived their own timeline (even though they traveled in time) one second at a time, the wormhole immortals fluttered back and forth in time, in an almost quantum mechanical and definitely non linear manner. Concentrating on a linear train of thought was somewhat distressing for them. They lived in the infinite random combinations of space time and were, for practical purposes, content.

Clearly the solution for the Q was not to die, but to become like the wormhole creatures; to cease linear being and simply be. Could this be like the eternity of heaven and hell? Who knows? And that’s the whole problem, isn’t it?

PLAYER57832 wrote:

tzor wrote:
There is an old joke about heaven and hell. In hell everyone is seated at a table with bowls of rice in front of them, but their chopsticks are so long they can’t stretch out their arms long enough to grab the rice from their bowls, never mind bringing the rice to their lips. In heaven, everyone is seated at a table with bowls of rice in front of them and the same chopsticks but they are all happy because they all feed each other.

I like this. Never heard it before. A good story.

One of the times I heard it there was an addendum.

The guy who was shown these things goes back to hell to tell them the solution to their problem. He tells them they could all feed each other like they're doing in heaven. Each one looks at the guy next to him and says, "That hypocrite? I'd rather starve!"

Oops, CC was on my daughter's account. That was me. We're playing a doubles game together. Loosing badly. The drop handed Australia and North America to the opposition.

2dimes wrote:Is this trolling or do people really believe the difference between a back rub and sunburn is simply perspective?

I don't troll. It's a serious question. Think about the difference between rich and poor people, you would expect rich people to be happier as they have a better quality of life (more back rubs anyway). However this is largely not true, because perspective does matter.

tzor wrote:There is an irony in that a lot of my thoughts on heaven are based on Star Trek. Unfortunately, they never managed to combine the threads in the series itself; a pity.

Before I go there, however, I just want to make an observation. We can get confused with the scientific understanding of people thousands of years ago when we say that God is in the “heavens.” They thought the universe at the time was a sphere or dome surrounded by water. God was outside His creation, as it were. If we view the universe today as a space time continuum, then God is outside space time. There is an implication of this in terms of time itself, because what we call time is simply a dimension within our own universe. What is outside our universe is truly unknown.

There are two models of the immortal in Star Trek. The “Q” were the perfect example of the linear infinity immortality that has been our traditional vision of heaven and hell. In the end they went crazy over infinite boredom and ended their own immortality.

A model that is closer to the traditional description of God (one who just simply is) was found in the wormhole immortals. Unlike the Q who lived their own timeline (even though they traveled in time) one second at a time, the wormhole immortals fluttered back and forth in time, in an almost quantum mechanical and definitely non linear manner. Concentrating on a linear train of thought was somewhat distressing for them. They lived in the infinite random combinations of space time and were, for practical purposes, content.

Clearly the solution for the Q was not to die, but to become like the wormhole creatures; to cease linear being and simply be. Could this be like the eternity of heaven and hell? Who knows? And that’s the whole problem, isn’t it?

If you live for an infinite amount of time you will live out every possible event an infinite amount of times, no matter if you go linearly or jump around.

CreepersWiener wrote: So, the lesson here is that you must first go through HELL to ultimately get to your Heaven.

Does marriage count? How about dealing with the parents of student-athletes (to use the term loosely)?

pmchugh wrote:

tzor wrote:There is an irony in that a lot of my thoughts on heaven are based on Star Trek. Unfortunately, they never managed to combine the threads in the series itself; a pity.

Before I go there, however, I just want to make an observation. We can get confused with the scientific understanding of people thousands of years ago when we say that God is in the “heavens.” They thought the universe at the time was a sphere or dome surrounded by water. God was outside His creation, as it were. If we view the universe today as a space time continuum, then God is outside space time. There is an implication of this in terms of time itself, because what we call time is simply a dimension within our own universe. What is outside our universe is truly unknown.

There are two models of the immortal in Star Trek. The “Q” were the perfect example of the linear infinity immortality that has been our traditional vision of heaven and hell. In the end they went crazy over infinite boredom and ended their own immortality.

A model that is closer to the traditional description of God (one who just simply is) was found in the wormhole immortals. Unlike the Q who lived their own timeline (even though they traveled in time) one second at a time, the wormhole immortals fluttered back and forth in time, in an almost quantum mechanical and definitely non linear manner. Concentrating on a linear train of thought was somewhat distressing for them. They lived in the infinite random combinations of space time and were, for practical purposes, content.

Clearly the solution for the Q was not to die, but to become like the wormhole creatures; to cease linear being and simply be. Could this be like the eternity of heaven and hell? Who knows? And that’s the whole problem, isn’t it?

If you live for an infinite amount of time you will live out every possible event an infinite amount of times, no matter if you go linearly or jump around.

Let me clarify... For the wormhole aliens, there was no such thing as time. It did not exist for them. You look at a piece of paper. You, immediately, all at once, see everything on that piece of paper. The wormhole aliens looked at time the same way. And to go through it linearly would be to go through that piece of paper, row by row, taking each individual point as it's on and building a sense of perspective from that, like we do with time, as opposed to taking it as a whole, like the wormhole aliens did with time. So to us, yes the wormhole aliens did live for an infinite amount of time, but for them, no they didn't because time was something so different, it's hard to call it time.

shut it ya fool, i am stupid.

Woodruff wrote:

CreepersWiener wrote: So, the lesson here is that you must first go through HELL to ultimately get to your Heaven.

Does marriage count? How about dealing with the parents of student-athletes (to use the term loosely)?

Marriage could be heaven...but Hell and Heaven all have to deal with emotions ultimately. Hell is the perception of zero love...while heaven is the perception of all love.

CreepersWiener wrote:

Woodruff wrote:

CreepersWiener wrote: So, the lesson here is that you must first go through HELL to ultimately get to your Heaven.

Does marriage count? How about dealing with the parents of student-athletes (to use the term loosely)?

Marriage could be heaven...but Hell and Heaven all have to deal with emotions ultimately. Hell is the perception of zero love...while heaven is the perception of all love.

Sounds like my first marriage

pmchugh wrote:shut it ya cunt i am rght

Well, that's certainly a highly-educated and infinitely well-supported response.

Woodruff wrote:

pmchugh wrote:shut it ya cunt i am rght

Well, that's certainly a highly-educated and infinitely well-supported response.

Drunken fool...

keyborn wrote:

pmchugh wrote:If you have eternal happyness then your mood never goes up or down. Without sadness how can you know what happyness is? Without bad there is no good is frequently said by religious people to say why bad things happen. So how is eternal happyness any better than eternal pain?

You're kidding right? Please tell me you are not serious. What is the difference between black and white, hot and cold, fast or slow, fat or skinny, and I could go on and on and on....

Pain is what you feel when you burn your hand on a hot stove...happiness is when you eat the awesome food cooked on that hot stove.

Need anymore examples?...sheesh....

Actually you really miss the point. What is cold, if the only thing that exist is hot?. Without mountains there is no concept of valley. Without sadness, happiness doesn't make any sense. Jeez. Some people are just so simple.

Falkomagno wrote:

keyborn wrote:

pmchugh wrote:If you have eternal happyness then your mood never goes up or down. Without sadness how can you know what happyness is? Without bad there is no good is frequently said by religious people to say why bad things happen. So how is eternal happyness any better than eternal pain?

You're kidding right? Please tell me you are not serious. What is the difference between black and white, hot and cold, fast or slow, fat or skinny, and I could go on and on and on....

Pain is what you feel when you burn your hand on a hot stove...happiness is when you eat the awesome food cooked on that hot stove.

Need anymore examples?...sheesh....

Actually you really miss the point. What is cold, if the only thing that exist is hot?. Without mountains there is no concept of valley. Without sadness, happiness doesn't make any sense. Jeez. Some people are just so simple.

That's not true for me. If I'm having a good day, eating some nice food being with family I just enjoy the moment. I don't think, "This is good because I had a tooth ache once and now I can understand this day.?

In fact I block bad memories. Time's I've been injured and had extreme pain. I know the pain was severe at the time but can't really feel it via memory. Which is a good thing also, but I take being able to walk again for granted just as I did before. I need to have a reason to think, "Wow, I'm lucky I can walk this is great." If your theory was right that the negative helps me enjoy the positive I'd be busy being happy I can walk all the time.

What is cold, if the only thing that exist is hot?.

Actually there is no such thing as cold. That is only a discription given so we can express a lack of heat.