Indeed. Seperate but equal doesn't work.

Hey we agree on something Snorri. That is why those practices and laws were abolished years ago.

I don't think that is what he was saying though. I think he was saying to do away with marriage as a civil term, and any couple (gay or straight) would enter ...

Now, you challenged me to find contradictions in the bible. I'm sure ther it's contradictions, my common sens bring me that simple example suddenly. this is two common use sentences from the bible:
"an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" Exodus 21:23–27
But also have this:
"turn the other cheek ...

Even if it turns out to be just a predisposition thing, there's still the restriction of a liberty which I see no good reason not to have.

But that is the thing, the liberty we are speaking of, is currently defined as a union between 1 man and 1 women. The "liberty" of marriage is not what gay ...

Well, there's no hard proof (although there is some evidence) of a gay gene (which is a misnomer anyway, as if there'd be only one gene for anything), but give me a break.

Yes but some evidence, in light of other evidence pointing to environmental issues, such as childhood trauma. There is lack ...

This is a matter of civil rights. And civil rights trump states' rights.

And here we are back to page #3 again. Johnblue made the bold claim that homosexuality was genetic. I asked for some sort of real scientific data or study information, no one responded. You are partialy correct, in that ...

mediamatters.org is not exactly the most unbiased source for information.

The truth of the matter is, cable news outlets of all forms are very biased. They all do things, and show extreme view-points in the name of ratings, and to try to get people fired up about things, that are often non-issues ...

b.k. barunt wrote:Has anyone ever told you that you take yourself waaay too seriously?

Its always good to know, that there is still one person takes me seriously.

read this until it sticks. I know it will, eventually.

I can read it over and over, and realise that it still doesn't agree with current legal rulings. Did you read the the quote I posted? Maybe if you re-read the full text of the case ruling you tried to use, you would realise that the court ...

I stand corrected. Your "Wooooooo wooooooo wooooooooo" obviously contains more meritous and substantive quality than anything i've said thus far.

I'm hold the same view as you do on this. I am pointing out that the slippery slope style argument, tends get people on the defensive, and is also a ...

once again, read what I have said on this. polygamy is not a 14th amendment issue because marriage by definition limits the number of participants to 2. legalizing it requires an honest to god redefinition of marriage that would have absolutely nothing to do with the 14th amendment.

Same coin ...

I think that's bull shit. Marriage is handled at the state level. Abortion should also be handled at the states level. Show me where in the constitution that Marriage is guaranteed as a civil liberty and I will eat my hat.

The supreme court seems to think the constitution guarantees marriage ...

Why isn't bestiality protected by the 14th Amendment? Why isn't polygamy protected by the 14th Amendment (and the 1st amendment for that matter)?

I'm not Sultan, but it's because (as far as I know) homosexuality is a genetic trait.

How about a study to back up a statement like that?

Also, what ...

My thoughts and prayers are with all of the family's who lost loved ones, and to the community as a whole. I have no doubt that it will be a very trying time for a very large number of people. The same goes for the city of Pittsburgh, who lost 3 officers, and the family's of the officers who died ...

I believe my conclusion was more well founded than yours. You are free to disagree.

What was my conclusion? I'm not even disagreeing. I'm asking you to back up your statement with some sort of data that proves the point you made.

And, your post makes it obvious you don't know that much about CA ...

you are looking at only one aspect, probably racial diversity. I am talking something well beyond that.

I'm not looking at any aspects. I did not state a premise or argument. I pointed out that you jumped to a conclusion without any evidence. How many times did I have to agree with you, that CA ...

I believe that as the bill is writen, for the most part there will be opt outs available. The issue is, that the opt out clauses are not included in the bill. The bill is very vague, and that is part of what scares me. There is very little verbage about manatory service in this bill, but the ...

First California is diverse in far more than just population, it is ecologically diverse, which leads to many more true differances than just aobut any other region in the world.


I was never saying california was not diverse, I was saying their are many other places in the USA, that are also ...

Because, the truth is that every kid DOES owe the country a debt, because the country has, to a point, supported every child in the United States. Some more than others, but always some.

If you really beleive they owe some sort of debt, they will pay that, through taxes that they pay during the ...

Snorri, I don't know that it will soften the blow. I think it will delay the blow, but it may not soften it. In fact, letting our shared economy's sit in a recession for an extended period of time, will likely cost more wealth, and more ills, than it is attempting to solve.

I dont disagree with ...

Understand, I am not saying all the rules are wonderful or necessary, but that they come as a result of huge diversity.

I think that is a bit of stretch. California is not the only state with a diverse population, and there are plenty of places were many different groups, from many different ...

Snorri, I don't know that it will soften the blow. I think it will delay the blow, but it may not soften it. In fact, letting our shared economy's sit in a recession for an extended period of time, will likely cost more wealth, and more ills, than it is attempting to solve.

The problem I have is the verbage of parts of the bill. The requirement for public schools taking certain grant money, that makes all students perform manditory service, is WAY beyond the Federal Governments scope. AmeriCore and other groups already got increased funding in other legislation, this ...

I think we agree on a lot of the stuff there...so I'm not going to comment on the first part.

What scares me the most now, is that governments are doing what the private sector did, and got us here. They are borrowing money they can't pay back, they are trying to manipulate asset values, and keep ...

That is the whole issue fruitcake. The value of the dollar, has no real value, beyond what you are able to purchase with it. With electronic money, and the ability to print cash money, you end up with issues like this. What we are seeing now is mearly a process of the artificial values of certain ...

Oh wait, that senator from WI... he looks like he's 20.... what's his face.... the economics expert... you know the one... shoot...

Paul Ryan?

I am generaly very conservative when it comes to government roles. There are certain aspects of many "liberals" that I respect. The same way that there ...