Logic dictates that there is a God!

[Backglass]

Simply conjuring up absurd straw men

Absurd? Like believing in men with wings & talking snakes?

posting a few smileys afterwards never really has passed for an argument anyway.

Shall we argue how many fairies can dance on the head of a pin then? It's about as worthwhile as arguing the existence of your invisible, magical creatures...

I say 1000. Go!

[Napoleon Ier]

Simply conjuring up absurd straw men

Absurd? Like believing in men with wings & talking snakes?

posting a few smileys afterwards never really has passed for an argument anyway.

Shall we argue how many fairies can dance on the head of a pin then? It's about as worthwhile as arguing the existence of your invisible, magical creatures...

I say 1000. Go!

Yes, both those things are absurd. What possible reason would you have for assuming serious Christian theologians in this day and age subscribe to belief in these things?

[OnlyAmbrose]

Yes, both those things are absurd. What possible reason would you have for assuming serious Christian theologians in this day and age subscribe to belief in these things?

Augustine certainly didn't, but a remarkable number of evangelicals do.

[Napoleon Ier]

Yes, both those things are absurd. What possible reason would you have for assuming serious Christian theologians in this day and age subscribe to belief in these things?

Augustine certainly didn't, but a remarkable number of evangelicals do.

AH! Belief in a magical, invisible, 2000 year old talking Augustine!

Don't be ridiculous!

[mpjh]

Ah, he wrote books that people who can read, do read.

[Napoleon Ier]

Ah, he wrote books that people who can read, do read.

And I don't believe that God is magical, nor a creature, nor that snakes literally talked, so what's your point?

[mpjh]

read the post.

[Lev306]

Existence can not come from nothingness...

What's your proof? Have you observed nothingness? Pure nothingness, no matter, no time, no dimensions, not even any space for there to be any matter.

Well following what science has told us so far, we haven't found anything that empircally shows existence coming from nothingness - ie. the sudden creation of mass or energy from seemingly no source. Secondly, since when was observation necessary. Have we witnessed four space? five space? six space? ... ten space? How do we know it exists? Is Brian Greene lying to us all? To make an even simpler example, we have never witnessed two space or one space, therefore it doesn't exist? Yet we are composed of two space and one space. By the same way we can envision multiple dimensions, we can imagine no dimension/no space(encompasses no time, no matter, etc). Alternatively you can imagine 2 states, one being the presence of anything, the other being the absence of presence of anything. Think light vs darkness, darkness is simply defined as the absence of light or a cs component, 1 vs 0. Well obviously they aren't exactly the same as existence vs. nothingness but thats the best way I can help you imagine it if you can't think of it.

Also note I'm not necessarily pointing to God. Think about this, perhaps this existence is just the dreams of a random person. Hes not god, but hes our creator nonetheless. This too could be as easily accepted as the idea of an intelligent creator; it all just comes down to personal belief.

Yup. And when this personal belief leads you to believe this "God" randomly intervenes in people's life and arbitrarily bans people for not following his weird rules, then it starts making less sense.


The problem with this argument is that it always seem to come from those who already have determined that this "creator" is none other than the deity they've been worshipping all along! What a miraculous cooincidence! They've already got a list of attributes and dislikes (few likes) that this creator should obviously have.

Yeah but thats more of a problem with people who choose to see it that way instead of treating it more in a scientific manner, not so much with the argument. After all, the reason for the vagueness of the definition is meant such that anything can really apply. Chaos itself could be the creator, who knows? Religious ppl just tend to see things the want to, but that pretty much goes for anything for them, natural phenomena included too, or freak accidents.

I see, your post is approaching nothingness and it is hard to see any life coming from that. I agree with snorri, nothingness is boring.

Exactly, the point can't get life outta nothing, but there we have a logical voucher for god that doesn't cross science in anyway. And yeah, nothingness is pretty damn boring, imagine wat it woulda been like if nothingness stayed that way. No cc, no smilies

[mpjh]

First, you haven't shown that something cannot come from nothing. Second, you haven't shown that there was ever a nothing.

[Lev306]

First, you haven't shown that something cannot come from nothing. Second, you haven't shown that there was ever a nothing.

1.You can empircally observe that everything in our observable universe has come from something, so there is no knowledge that we know of yet that shows that something can come from nothing. This is exactly the same reasoning that dictates the theory of evolution. Evolution is accepted and agreed upon as science and true because there has been no theory that better explains how life exists in its current form and no proof of anything that contradicts natural selection. Missing link or not, its only the lack of concrete proof that prevents evolution from being accepted but not denounced as completely false.

2.I'm not arguing that there necessarily has to be a nothing. If there is a something, there is also the possibility of a nothing.

[MeDeFe]

2.I'm not arguing that there necessarily has to be a nothing. If there is a something, there is also the possibility of a nothing.

Care to elaborate? Because I'm not sure if and how that makes sense.

[jonesthecurl]

So: "Intelligent Design".
What made it?
Or is a something that came out of nothing?

[dellmanlego]

God Exists! By an 8TH grader telling you off! Atheists be ware of frustration!
#1 Since when did destruction (big bang) create life. tell me when the last time that happened!
#2 Why did "scientist" find the fossils for the caber toothed tiger thousands of miles apart from each other?
#3 The Bible stated the earth went around the sun before the first "scientist" figured it out
#4 Now I need you to look this up the Bible says that Babylon would never be rebuilt... See how far Saddam Hu Cane come in its Reconstruction people died from "accidents" and all the further he could get built is the gateway in your face Atheists!
#5 Go to Egypt "Scientists" say the records there are accurate. Why is the story of Josef there?
#6 a sample from the believed arc was sent to a carbon dating center yep 2000 BC then it was sent there unlabeled several million years old does this sound right???
#7 "Scientists" them selfs state that an organism can not gain nor lose chromosomes so how did animals evolve?
#8 Communism is a atheist country with a dictator who attempts to force it upon them
#9 the end day prophecies there will be wars and rumors of wars... tragedies of earthquakes, fire, storms will be more severe
#10

Kinda like how 1 and -1 together makes 0

the natural tendency of mater and anti mater is to cancel out
#11

I think that trying to use religion as a science or science as a religion is wrong

Bible "a man can't serve two masters" I'm pretty sure that is not rocket science
#12

Nothing is certain

there is not one Bible prophecy proved to be wrong, if so show me it I dare you
#13

China (the "Army of the East")... Russia ( the "Army to the North") will attack Israel but be destroyed by China.

This is wrong taken out of context Army of North=God's side Army of South=Devil
#14 Just because God lets everyone make their own chaises it does not mean that he doesn't interfere with the world
#15 Challenge

I have Jesus and you can't top that authority buddy! But since you claim to be an OM lets put you to the test.....

1. Moses 2. John 3. it is referring to the death of Jesus died on Friday the "new" temple is in heaven 4. sacrifice a pure lamb 5. the lamb represented Christ Jesus 6."sell all thy goods and follow me"-Jesus talking to prince (how did I do PS I didn't use a reference)
#16 Adaptation is not evolution... evolution is where the original can no longer produce with the new which has never happened micoevolution has happened though
#17 Sodom and Gomorrah have sulfur (brimstone) there from where god sent it down from the heavens

I shall continue to edit this post and add more (PS send me a pm so i can respond but also put it on the post)(I've referenced with the first 23 pages and my own personal responses)

[got tonkaed]

God Exists!
#1 Since when did destruction (big bang) create life. tell me when the last time that happened!
#2 Why did "scientist" find the fossils for the caber toothed tiger thousands of miles apart from each other?
#3 The Bible stated the earth went around the sun before the first "scientist" figured it out
#4 Now I need you to look this up the Bible says that Babylon would never be rebuilt... See how far Saddam Hu Cane come in its Reconstruction people died from "accidents" and all the further he could get built is the gateway in your face Atheists!
#5 Go to Egypt "Scientists" say the records there are accurate. Why is the story of Josef there?
#6 a sample from the believed arc was sent to a carbon dating center yep BC then it was sent there unlabeled several million years old does this sound right???

I shall continue to edit this post

I can only hope you do so every 5 monts or so, so i can comment on how great a bump it was each time.

[Neoteny]

This thread is proof that our traditional concepts of life are flawed. Screw three days, this thread comes back after months and months.

[jonesthecurl]

Although the lack of oxygen does seem to have affected its brain.
Unless the great age of the thread simply brought on Alzheimers.

[jay_a2j]

#13

China (the "Army of the East")... Russia ( the "Army to the North") will attack Israel but be destroyed by China.

Knock Knock sounds like WWII to me Germany and Russia

#15

I have Jesus and you can't top that authority buddy! But since you claim to be an OM lets put you to the test.....

1. Moses 2. John 3. it is referring to the death of Jesus died on Friday the "new" temple is in heaven 4. sacrifice a pure lamb 5. the lamb represented Christ Jesus 6."sell all thy goods and follow me"-Jesus talking to prince (how did I do PS I didn't use a reference)

I shall continue to edit this post and add more (PS send me a pm so i can respond but also put it on the post)(I've referenced with the first 15 pages and my own personal responses)

Nice bump. I believe the 2 above quotes are mine. #13 Israel did not exist until after WWII , so that prediction (found in Revelation) could not possibly be speaking of WWII.

#15 What are you talking about???????

[Iliad]

God Exists! By an 8TH grader telling you off! Atheists be ware of frustration!
#1 Since when did destruction (big bang) create life. tell me when the last time that happened!
#2 Why did "scientist" find the fossils for the caber toothed tiger thousands of miles apart from each other?
#3 The Bible stated the earth went around the sun before the first "scientist" figured it out
#4 Now I need you to look this up the Bible says that Babylon would never be rebuilt... See how far Saddam Hu Cane come in its Reconstruction people died from "accidents" and all the further he could get built is the gateway in your face Atheists!
#5 Go to Egypt "Scientists" say the records there are accurate. Why is the story of Josef there?
#6 a sample from the believed arc was sent to a carbon dating center yep BC then it was sent there unlabeled several million years old does this sound right???
#7 "Scientists" them selfs state that an organism can not gain nor lose chromosomes so how did animals evolve?
#8 Communism is a atheist country with a dictator who attempts to force it upon them
#9 the end day prophecies there will be wars and rumors of wars... tragedies of earthquakes, fire, storms will be more severe
#10

Kinda like how 1 and -1 together makes 0

the natural tendency of mater and anti mater is to cancel out
#11

I think that trying to use religion as a science or science as a religion is wrong

Bible "a man can't serve two masters" I'm pretty sure that is not rocket science
#12

Nothing is certain

there is not one Bible prophecy proved to be wrong, if so show me it I dare you
#13

China (the "Army of the East")... Russia ( the "Army to the North") will attack Israel but be destroyed by China.

This is wrong taken out of context Army of North=God's side Army of South=Devil
#14 Just because God lets everyone make their own chaises it does not mean that he doesn't interfere with the world
#15 Challenge

I have Jesus and you can't top that authority buddy! But since you claim to be an OM lets put you to the test.....

1. Moses 2. John 3. it is referring to the death of Jesus died on Friday the "new" temple is in heaven 4. sacrifice a pure lamb 5. the lamb represented Christ Jesus 6."sell all thy goods and follow me"-Jesus talking to prince (how did I do PS I didn't use a reference)
#16 Adaptation is not evolution... evolution is where the original can no longer produce with the new which has never happened
#17 Sodom and Gomorrah have sulfur (brimstone) there from where god sent it down from the heavens

I shall continue to edit this post and add more (PS send me a pm so i can respond but also put it on the post)(I've referenced with the first 23 pages and my own personal responses)

I can only hope you will one day try to critically think instead of using slogans handed out by your pastor.

One day you will.

[StiffMittens]

#16 Adaptation is not evolution... evolution is where the original can no longer produce with the new which has never happened

What you are describing is speciation. Evolution is succinctly defined here: http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/evolution-definition.html.

[Snorri1234]

The big bang was destruction????

[MeDeFe]

The big bang was destruction????

Yeah, I was wondering about that, too.

[Balsiefen]

I think this thread may be god, it seems to be equally immortal.

The big bang was destruction????

Yeah, I was wondering about that, too.

I was wondering about quite a bit of that post, it makes fun reading.

[MeDeFe]

I think this thread may be god, it seems to be equally immortal.

The big bang was destruction????

Yeah, I was wondering about that, too.

I was wondering about quite a bit of that post, it makes fun reading.

But the grammar gets worse and worse throughout the post.

[Snorri1234]

I think this thread may be god, it seems to be equally immortal.

The big bang was destruction????

Yeah, I was wondering about that, too.

I was wondering about quite a bit of that post, it makes fun reading.

But the grammar gets worse and worse throughout the post.

It's fun trying to figure out what he's actually saying.

[Juan_Bottom]

It's fun trying to figure out what he's actually saying.

I know right?
by his/her being vauge I don't know what to argue with... kinda like the Bible...

#16 Adaptation is not evolution... evolution is where the original can no longer produce with the new which has never happened

What you are describing is speciation. Evolution is succinctly defined here: http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/evolution-definition.html.

Also, I believe this has been witnessed and recorded with single celled organisms.

I won't bother with the rest of witnessed examples of evolution... just be aware that it has happened in your lifetime.