Who's the worst leader?

[strike wolf]

Nobody is stopping all of you from moving to North Korea.

Good point. I'll see that you get my post card.

[flashleg8]

Nobody is stopping all of you from moving to North Korea.

I'm more worth to the movement agitating in the west and sending spying reports back to Kim about the mood of the Great Satan’s citizens gained by joining on-line forums

[b.k. barunt]

Flashleg, stop! You'll give us all away! Why should i go to North Korea? I'm not the one fucking up the country. Send Georgie Boy to North Korea. You go with him.

[Burrito Loco]

I'll cede that Bush is the least competent man on that list. However, I believe that he thinks he is helping the world, whereas Mugabe is out for his own ass, Blair is, well, Blair, Kim Jong Ill is actually insane which sort of takes him off the list, and Iran is also nuts, of course, if they succeed we'll never have to worry about anything in the middle east again after Israel and Iran duke it out.

[Numia Kereru]

It's times like these I really appreciate being in my little corner of the world

Not that we aren't without our own internal strife here, but it's nowhere near the magnitude of anything any of those leaders get up to

[Stopper]

I'll cede that Bush is the least competent man on that list. However, I believe that he thinks he is helping the world

Proverb Of The Day - The path to hell is paved with good intentions.

[Kid_A]

you forgot Papa Smurf! Leader of the Smurf people! He wasn't on your list

[b.k. barunt]

Burrito, do you really think that Bush cares about the world, the U.S., or anything outside of the steadily rising stocks of Halburton? If so, i have some beautiful oceanfront lots you might be interested in . . . in Arizona.

[Mjolnirs]

However, I believe that he thinks he is helping the world...

Now that's just crazy talk. These people actually think he wants to destroy America and take the world with him. How can he be an Evil Satan if he has good intentions? Why would any world leader really want to combat terrorism or oppose tyrannical dictators if it wasn't for their oil?

Burrito, do you really think that Bush cares about the world, the U.S., or anything outside of the steadily rising stocks of Halburton? If so, i have some beautiful oceanfront lots you might be interested in . . . in Arizona.

See what I mean?

[b.k. barunt]

Oppose tryanical dictators? Is that why we're in Iraq? I guess it's just coincidence that Halburton stock is going through the roof now. Maybe we should remind the people in Chile that america doesn't like tryranical dictators. Maybe we should bring Somoza back to Nicaragua (oh yeah, we already tried that). Have some more kool-aid, it will all turn out ok.

[Mjolnirs]

It is one of the reasons we went into Iraq. I'm sorry to inform you of this, but US foreign policy is now, and has always been a complicated thing.

I love Kool-aid, although I think you mean Flavor Aid. I'll keep drinking it as long as you remember to use name brand, not store brand, tin foil for your conspiracy hat.

[Eh! Steven]

Who is the worst leader in the world?

Oneself.

Stir that around in the noodle.

[b.k. barunt]

A complicated thing? No shit!? Those words are bandied around a lot wherever progaganda and disinformation abound. Here's another favorite on capital hill - "I have no recollection". Weren't we supposed to be in Iraq because of nuclear weapons? Where are these nuclear weapons that justified the invasion? Now you tell us that we went in to overthrow a dictator. And the populace is sooo greatful that we rescued them. Why am i not surprised that the kool-aid reference escaped you? Oh, and Eh! Steven, maybe you should emend that to Eh? Steven.

[Mjolnirs]

A complicated thing? No shit!? Those words are bandied around a lot wherever progaganda and disinformation abound.

What? Are you denying that foreign policy is complicated? So if any administration, no matter who is in power, says that dealing with other countries is complicated; that keeping multiple parties happy; and sometimes dealing with countries you would rather not deal with, they are spouting propaganda?

Weren't we supposed to be in Iraq because of nuclear weapons? Where are these nuclear weapons that justified the invasion? Now you tell us that we went in to overthrow a dictator. And the populace is sooo greatful that we rescued them.

Nukes were one of the reasons. As I've mentioned in a previous post, that intel was bad, but at the time congress and the UN thought it accurate. Another reason we went in is because Hussein, a tyranical dictator, had flat out lied to and refused to cooperate with the UN for years. He was killing his own people and was believed to be building a nuclear program. The UN sanctioned what was done at the time.

Why am i not surprised that the kool-aid reference escaped you?

Again, what? Please explain to me how the kool-aid reference escaped me. Better yet, maybe you should tell me what you think the kool-aid reference is to you.

[flashleg8]

I'll cede that Bush is the least competent man on that list. However, I believe that he thinks he is helping the world

Proverb Of The Day - The path to hell is paved with good intentions.

I bloody knew you would quote me in your sig!

[unriggable]

Nukes were one of the reasons. As I've mentioned in a previous post, that intel was bad, but at the time congress and the UN thought it accurate. Another reason we went in is because Hussein, a tyranical dictator, had flat out lied to and refused to cooperate with the UN for years. He was killing his own people and was believed to be building a nuclear program. The UN sanctioned what was done at the time.

There were two reasons to go in:

1. WMDs. We never found them. Umm, explain this to me, please? Not only did we have good intel, but Saddam welcomed weapons investigators, (or whatever they're called) and Bush refused to send them.
2. Terrorists. Links to Al Quada. Of course Bush said we went in for that, then he said 'we have no proof that saddam was involved in 9-11. Somehow it's okay to say that, and it's not okay to support the war when 'facts' are presented and to oppose the war when these 'facts' are disproved.
The Iraq war is nothing more than the US holding a loaded gun up to an innocent man's head and saying "it's for your own good".

As for Hussein not cooperating with the UN, look in the mirror. The UN, representing most of the world, tells the US not to invade, and the US, in it's infinite wisdom, ignores it.

[CrazyAnglican]

Nobody is stopping all of you from moving to North Korea.

I'm more worth to the movement agitating in the west and sending spying reports back to Kim about the mood of the Great Satan’s citizens gained by joining on-line forums

Awww, I bet you say that to all the governments

[CrazyAnglican]

It's times like these I really appreciate being in my little corner of the world

Not that we aren't without our own internal strife here, but it's nowhere near the magnitude of anything any of those leaders get up to

Really? Let me know. If Hillary wins, the presidency, I may be your next door neighbor, and no that's not a joke

[CrazyAnglican]

Again, what? Please explain to me how the kool-aid reference escaped me. Better yet, maybe you should tell me what you think the kool-aid reference is to you.

I think his Kool Aid reference was a reference to the Jim Jones cult. They all offed themselves, at Jimbo's command, by drinking cyanide laced Kool Aid in the late 1970's. I guess thinking that anyone in power could be anything but a lying scoundrel makes us both mindless sycophants who would rather deny our inmost desire for self preservation than embrace the obvious conspiracies in the world. But hey, you have to realize, I'm part of the right wing conspiracy and therefore can't be trusted so please disregard this message.

I can't see how you would have missed this reference. I mean you are over 35 aren't you.

[Stopper]

I'll cede that Bush is the least competent man on that list. However, I believe that he thinks he is helping the world

Proverb Of The Day - The path to hell is paved with good intentions.

I bloody knew you would quote me in your sig!

I like good quotes, though, and I think yours was everything a good quote should be - succinct, and to-the-point. I think it should get a wider audience. Don't worry, I'll take it off. In a day or two.

[luns101]

WMDs. We never found them. Umm, explain this to me, please?

1. United Nations Resolution 678 authorized the use of military force to eject Sadaam Hussein out of Kuwait after he killed and butchered their citizens. The United States along with a coaliton of countries used that force.

2. United Nations Resolution 687 set the terms for the "cease-fire". It was not the end of the conflict, it was only a "cease-fire". 687 says that if Sadaam does not end his weapons of mass destruction program or attempts further hostilities, then 678 will be invoked again and military force resumed.

3. Sadaam Hussen tried to assasinate George Bush, Sr. in April of 1993 by using hidden explosives in a Toyota Landcruiser. The Kuwaitis recovered the Landcruiser. (I know, I know, "lefties", you don't believe there is any evidence to tie Hussein to that and it never happened, and even if it did...you would spout out something sarcastic like 'too bad they missed')

4. George W. Bush went to the United Nations and presented his case against Sadaam Hussein's violations of UN Resolution 687. In addition to the U.S., the intelligence agencies of Germany, Russia, France, and England all said that Sadaam Hussein had WMD's. The United Nations passed Resolution #1441, which gave Hussein "a final opportunity to comply with its disarmament obligations". Hussein refused.

5. The U.S. and a different coalition of countries "resumed" military force due to Hussein's non-compliance. We were victorious.

6. Since the end of the 2nd use of major military force against Hussein over 500 chemical weapons have been found in Iraq containing sarin nerve agents and 'mustard' gas. Although these chemical weapons were not 'useable' they do prove that Sadaam Hussein was lying when he said he dismantled his chemical weapons program. I guess the UN inspectors aren't infallible.

7. Former Iraqi General Georges Sada tells how Sadaam Hussein transported WMD's from Iraq to Syria under the pretense of a humanitarian aid mission in 2002. (An irrigation dam collapsed in Zeyzoun, Syria in 2002).

8. Ali Ibrahim al-Tikriti, former southern regional commander for Saddam Hussein's Fedayeen militia, has said that Sadaam Hussein gave logistical and material support to Palestinian militias. He also says that Hussein gave support to Al-Qaeda.

9. We now know that the United Nations Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission, through satellite tracking, has said that WMD-related scraps have been tracked and shown to have been moved from June 2003 - June 2004 to countries such as Jordan. The UNMVIC stated that although Hussein's efforts to build unmanned ariel vehicles to deliver chemical/biological agents failed, he did attempt to contruct them.

10. The Iraq Survey Group concluded that although Iraq probably destroyed much of its WMD stockpiles, Hussein continued to research biological weapons by using human beings in the mid-1990's.

I don't intend to convince Guiscard, Flashleg8, Unriggable, B.K. Barunt, or Stopper (sorry if I left any of the usuals out). To the few of you out there who are open-minded and don't just keep repeating "Bush lied and people died", I offer the other side.

[Guiscard]

WMDs. We never found them. Umm, explain this to me, please?

1. United Nations Resolution 678 authorized the use of military force to eject Sadaam Hussein out of Kuwait after he killed and butchered their citizens. The United States along with a coaliton of countries used that force.

2. United Nations Resolution 687 set the terms for the "cease-fire". It was not the end of the conflict, it was only a "cease-fire". 687 says that if Sadaam does not end his weapons of mass destruction program or attempts further hostilities, then 678 will be invoked again and military force resumed.

3. Sadaam Hussen tried to assasinate George Bush, Sr. in April of 1993 by using hidden explosives in a Toyota Landcruiser. The Kuwaitis recovered the Landcruiser. (I know, I know, "lefties", you don't believe there is any evidence to tie Hussein to that and it never happened, and even if it did...you would spout out something sarcastic like 'too bad they missed')

4. George W. Bush went to the United Nations and presented his case against Sadaam Hussein's violations of UN Resolution 687. In addition to the U.S., the intelligence agencies of Germany, Russia, France, and England all said that Sadaam Hussein had WMD's. The United Nations passed Resolution #1441, which gave Hussein "a final opportunity to comply with its disarmament obligations". Hussein refused.

5. The U.S. and a different coalition of countries "resumed" military force due to Hussein's non-compliance. We were victorious.

6. Since the end of the 2nd use of major military force against Hussein over 500 chemical weapons have been found in Iraq containing sarin nerve agents and 'mustard' gas. Although these chemical weapons were not 'useable' they do prove that Sadaam Hussein was lying when he said he dismantled his chemical weapons program. I guess the UN inspectors aren't infallible.

7. Former Iraqi General Georges Sada tells how Sadaam Hussein transported WMD's from Iraq to Syria under the pretense of a humanitarian aid mission in 2002. (An irrigation dam collapsed in Zeyzoun, Syria in 2002).

8. Ali Ibrahim al-Tikriti, former southern regional commander for Saddam Hussein's Fedayeen militia, has said that Sadaam Hussein gave logistical and material support to Palestinian militias. He also says that Hussein gave support to Al-Qaeda.

9. We now know that the United Nations Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission, through satellite tracking, has said that WMD-related scraps have been tracked and shown to have been moved from June 2003 - June 2004 to countries such as Jordan. The UNMVIC stated that although Hussein's efforts to build unmanned ariel vehicles to deliver chemical/biological agents failed, he did attempt to contruct them.

10. The Iraq Survey Group concluded that although Iraq probably destroyed much of its WMD stockpiles, Hussein continued to research biological weapons by using human beings in the mid-1990's.

I don't intend to convince Guiscard, Flashleg8, Unriggable, B.K. Barunt, or Stopper (sorry if I left any of the usuals out). To the few of you out there who are open-minded and don't just keep repeating "Bush lied and people died", I offer the other side.

Bollocks.

[CrazyAnglican]

Bollocks.

It's to the point, but what does it mean?

[Stopper]

Bollocks.

It's to the point, but what does it mean?

It means it's codswallop.

[sfhbballnut]

WMDs. We never found them. Umm, explain this to me, please?

1. United Nations Resolution 678 authorized the use of military force to eject Sadaam Hussein out of Kuwait after he killed and butchered their citizens. The United States along with a coaliton of countries used that force.

2. United Nations Resolution 687 set the terms for the "cease-fire". It was not the end of the conflict, it was only a "cease-fire". 687 says that if Sadaam does not end his weapons of mass destruction program or attempts further hostilities, then 678 will be invoked again and military force resumed.

3. Sadaam Hussen tried to assasinate George Bush, Sr. in April of 1993 by using hidden explosives in a Toyota Landcruiser. The Kuwaitis recovered the Landcruiser. (I know, I know, "lefties", you don't believe there is any evidence to tie Hussein to that and it never happened, and even if it did...you would spout out something sarcastic like 'too bad they missed')

4. George W. Bush went to the United Nations and presented his case against Sadaam Hussein's violations of UN Resolution 687. In addition to the U.S., the intelligence agencies of Germany, Russia, France, and England all said that Sadaam Hussein had WMD's. The United Nations passed Resolution #1441, which gave Hussein "a final opportunity to comply with its disarmament obligations". Hussein refused.

5. The U.S. and a different coalition of countries "resumed" military force due to Hussein's non-compliance. We were victorious.

6. Since the end of the 2nd use of major military force against Hussein over 500 chemical weapons have been found in Iraq containing sarin nerve agents and 'mustard' gas. Although these chemical weapons were not 'useable' they do prove that Sadaam Hussein was lying when he said he dismantled his chemical weapons program. I guess the UN inspectors aren't infallible.

7. Former Iraqi General Georges Sada tells how Sadaam Hussein transported WMD's from Iraq to Syria under the pretense of a humanitarian aid mission in 2002. (An irrigation dam collapsed in Zeyzoun, Syria in 2002).

8. Ali Ibrahim al-Tikriti, former southern regional commander for Saddam Hussein's Fedayeen militia, has said that Sadaam Hussein gave logistical and material support to Palestinian militias. He also says that Hussein gave support to Al-Qaeda.

9. We now know that the United Nations Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission, through satellite tracking, has said that WMD-related scraps have been tracked and shown to have been moved from June 2003 - June 2004 to countries such as Jordan. The UNMVIC stated that although Hussein's efforts to build unmanned ariel vehicles to deliver chemical/biological agents failed, he did attempt to contruct them.

10. The Iraq Survey Group concluded that although Iraq probably destroyed much of its WMD stockpiles, Hussein continued to research biological weapons by using human beings in the mid-1990's.

I don't intend to convince Guiscard, Flashleg8, Unriggable, B.K. Barunt, or Stopper (sorry if I left any of the usuals out). To the few of you out there who are open-minded and don't just keep repeating "Bush lied and people died", I offer the other side.

thank you, finally a voice of reason