Crusades Mafia The English and a Survior Win!

[aage]

I don't dictate the game. I wasn't the cop who called him out. But ok, if you think it's wise to go after the claimed English guy do your worst...

[TheSaxlad]

Firstly you may not buy my story, but look back to the flying pumpkin with laser beams shooting out of its arse incident. Dont make the same mistake.

Secondly, we are automatically assuming there is only three factions. Why can't there be for or more. We are worrying about English vs French, why couldn't there be a cult that recruits and with all this jibber jabber we are letting them slowly take over.

Thirdly I have NO NIGHT KILL, just a protect, and I know what faction tails is however I don't know his power.

Last my vote stays on Haggis, As an English Doctor why would I be a threat, can we just eliminate the threat we know about, the one who has a nk and then get round to discussing other threats?

My Vote stays on Haggis.

[TA1LGUNN3R]

First of all, just because Sax can protect me, it doesn't necessarily mean I'm on the same faction that he is. It seems logical that the factions could be intertwined. Don't assume that if you target me or Sax you'll hit the same faction.

While lynching Haggis might be in his best interests, it definitely is not in the rest of us.

Why? If Haggis is part of the Muslim faction, then eliminating that faction would simplify things. That is, if naxus' claim holds water.

It is pretty clear imo that french and english will fight one another(in game: the promised twist, the fact that they are segregated and not just crusaders, out of game, it's the french and the english, need i say more?)

IF the English and the French (they haven't been confirmed yet) were to turn on each other, having the Muslims left around would surely complicate things. Although I do think that they would turn on each other.

-Tails

[aage]

Lemme ask a question.

Haggis, what ability do you have?

[Iliad]

Firstly you may not buy my story, but look back to the flying pumpkin with laser beams shooting out of its arse incident. Dont make the same mistake.

Secondly, we are automatically assuming there is only three factions. Why can't there be for or more. We are worrying about English vs French, why couldn't there be a cult that recruits and with all this jibber jabber we are letting them slowly take over.

Thirdly I have NO NIGHT KILL, just a protect, and I know what faction tails is however I don't know his power.

Last my vote stays on Haggis, As an English Doctor why would I be a threat, can we just eliminate the threat we know about, the one who has a nk and then get round to discussing other threats?

My Vote stays on Haggis.

I'm believing it in parts, but I'm quite sure you are leaving out information. I'm convinced that you're a doc, but not so much that you're english, seeing as / was an english bodyguard and with a faction being 3-4 people, I doubt two power roles would be protective. Even if you are telling the truth and you are english, while tails is some french faction player who you are nursing, your lynch will hurt both the strongest factions atm.

Sure there could be a cult. Without any evidence this is just a desperate attempt to divert attention.

The problem here is that Haggis might be a threat to you, if he has a night kill, but he is not a threat to the rest of us.

First of all, just because Sax can protect me, it doesn't necessarily mean I'm on the same faction that he is. It seems logical that the factions could be intertwined. Don't assume that if you target me or Sax you'll hit the same faction.

While lynching Haggis might be in his best interests, it definitely is not in the rest of us.

Why? If Haggis is part of the Muslim faction, then eliminating that faction would simplify things. That is, if naxus' claim holds water.

It is pretty clear imo that french and english will fight one another(in game: the promised twist, the fact that they are segregated and not just crusaders, out of game, it's the french and the english, need i say more?)

IF the English and the French (they haven't been confirmed yet) were to turn on each other, having the Muslims left around would surely complicate things. Although I do think that they would turn on each other.

-Tails

Lynching haggis would simplify things for the other two factions. As it stands he is barrier between French and English victory and rather than waste our lynch, we should force the stronger factions to try and kill him and therefore lose a night kill. Right now Haggis is a powerful hedge fund against the other two factions as he is of no threat, being an exposed scum.

I'm not entirely sure how this whole French, English thing is going to work, there might be some kind of condition that triggers war between french or english, or maybe just after a set amount of days or perhaps they are at war already, though it's unlikely since there were only two kills.

Also this discussion I fell is falling on deaf ears as only half of us are actually posting and without the other half I really don't see this discussion developing greatly.

[edocsil]

I have a funeral to attend today, but I will send out prods on Saturday.

[Commander9]

A lot of above posts pretty much said what I've been saying for a while. It's very likely that there are more than 3 factions and while those fight, someone else will walk away - just saying. Furthermore, I really like Iliad's post, but it seems like it wall on deaf ears.

[Thezzaruz]

I don't dictate the game.

You certainly have tried though.

First of all, just because Sax can protect me, it doesn't necessarily mean I'm on the same faction that he is. It seems logical that the factions could be intertwined. Don't assume that if you target me or Sax you'll hit the same faction.

Well doesn't this reek of "I need to distance myself from my attention getting scum buddy"...
This is actually the first time I've gotten the "I'm scummy" vibe off you, noted for future reference.

Why? If Haggis is part of the Muslim faction, then eliminating that faction would simplify things.

Simplify things? In a multi faction situation aiming for the weakest might simplify things but it isn't a winning strategy.

Secondly, we are automatically assuming there is only three factions.

I'm not. My assumption simply is that there are more than 2 factions.

We are worrying about English vs French, why couldn't there be a cult that recruits and with all this jibber jabber we are letting them slowly take over.

Don't see how a Cult is likely. And I agree with Illy that mention it now (especially in that way) just seems to be a case of "look at anyone but me". Scummy IMO.

Following on from my last post I had a chance to search someone before the game started, one of edocs twists i spose, and i wanted a scum tell so I searched tails.

Oh I know his alignment alright. Patient Doctor, Edoc being edoc I suppose.

and I know what faction tails is however I don't know his power.

Hmm. So far you have claimed to know tails alignment (but you haven't actually said what it is) both because of your one time investigation and because of being his doctor. So which is it?

My vote stays, saxlad is just giving off far to much of a scummy vibe atm to be left alive.

[TA1LGUNN3R]

First of all, just because Sax can protect me, it doesn't necessarily mean I'm on the same faction that he is. It seems logical that the factions could be intertwined. Don't assume that if you target me or Sax you'll hit the same faction.

Well doesn't this reek of "I need to distance myself from my attention getting scum buddy"...
This is actually the first time I've gotten the "I'm scummy" vibe off you, noted for future reference.

Of course I'm trying to distance myself from your belief that sax is connected to me. I have no qualms in admitting that. He's practically put a target on my back. He said something along the lines of "hey I can protect so-and-so and in a few days he becomes super awesome." That totally fucks me. I know nothing of this plot, and tbh he could've made it up (especially where he said it was unknown to me as a nice little disclaimer. Is he that good?). But pressuring this could be part of your win condition. But I must reiterate, just because he has an alleged connection w/ me doesn't mean we're on the same faction.

Simplify things? In a multi faction situation aiming for the weakest might simplify things but it isn't a winning strategy.

Again, why? If you turn your back on an enemy, he's gonna stab you. Meaning if the English and supposed French do turn on each other, then the Muslims will just wait until everyone's as weak as they are. We don't know what kind of abilities the remaining Muslims have, or for that matter any of the other factions.

So I'm torn between voting for sax and Haggis.

-Tails

[aage]

Again, why? If you turn your back on an enemy, he's gonna stab you.

And this is why we should not let Haggis live longer than today.

[aage]

Post please... Two days is a long time with so much to discuss... Especially since a bunch of people are not posting...

[Iliad]

The problem is, we kind of reached the extent on the discussion on merits of lynching haggis vs saxlad, however half the town isn't posting and this game aint gonna move without some prods.

[Commander9]

I've already stated my case and my vote and so far I've not seen anything to convince me to do differently. Since I am not herk, I don't post if I don't have anything to say. Oh, wait...

[Thezzaruz]

however half the town isn't posting and this game aint gonna move without some prods.

Well yea, to some extent.
We're 10 players left and 7 has a vote out there (4 on sax & 3 on haggis). Haggis, tails and Fircoal being the ones that's still undecided.

[TheSaxlad]

right, I can see why your all voting for me but give me a chance to live, and serve the army in my full capacity.

[edocsil]

Prodded everyone who hadn't posted in the last 2 pages.

[aage]

Right, thanks...

So why does Haggis still live?

[edocsil]

VOTE COUNT

Haggis (3) ~ Naxus, Aage, Sax
Sax (4) ~ Iliad, Commander, Violet, Thezz

10 alive 6 to lynch

[VioIet]

right, I can see why your all voting for me but give me a chance to live, and serve the army in my full capacity.

WTH

Who says we want you to serve the army. And first of all, what army?
Aren't you a doctor? How can you serve the army as a doctor.
Unless you mean service to the army, by protecting someone at night.

I still don't get the whole connection between you and tails. How do you know his role?

[aage]

right, I can see why your all voting for me but give me a chance to live, and serve the army in my full capacity.

WTH

Who says we want you to serve the army. And first of all, what army?
Aren't you a doctor? How can you serve the army as a doctor.
Unless you mean service to the army, by protecting someone at night.

I still don't get the whole connection between you and tails. How do you know his role?

I can see why this post is disturbing you, because it disturbs me as well, but that doesn't change the fact that there happens to be someone out there of whom we 100% sure know he's not on the "crusade" team and is only alive because the player you're quoting there is drawing attention away from him. There is a slight chance he's telling the truth though, so I believe it's best to just kill Haggis today...

[naxus]

Once again i have to say KILL HAGGIS. I investigated him and know he's part of the Muslim Army. Either way the game is set up he's still the common enemy and deserves to die

[Haggis_McMutton]

If I were town and there would be two mafia groups (which is what this game looks like from anyone's perspective, if you're right) it's best to eliminate one of the two mafia factions (relatively these are mafia factions, since they're "enemies" of anyone's faction).
(This is getting very theoretical, I hope you're still with me.) This is because it would take away one random factor, i.e. the night kill of this third mafia faction, in this case the Muslim faction.

By the same logic, in a 3 player game it's ALWAYS best to eliminate one of the players, no matter what the situation? No because it doesn't matter wether you come in 2nd or you come in 3rd, you still lose.
If you are in the middle strength-wise then it absolutely is a bad move to help the strong guy kill off the weak guy, because guess what, you just killed off your only potential ally and now there's nowhere to hide.

Either faction is better off without them since neither of them can predict what side the muslims will choose, not to mention the fact that they will back stab the other two factions once these are decimated, or the unknown abilities these muslims have. Night kill? Does it stop there? English army seems to have a cop and a doc already, so if all factions are equal the muslims also have a doc and a cop which can also randomly tip the scales into either the English or the French faction's favor.

Pure speculation. I might as well say that maybe the muslims don't even have a NK anymore(which is quite possible). The only facts are: Muslim leader and second in command are down, this makes the muslims the weakest right now, so the "OMG they're going to kill us all" theories are really misplaced.
Moreover, you don't have to "trust" the muslims, the fact is, it's in the muslim's as well as the english's interest to take down the french a notch and level the playing field. Everybody wants to win.

Since you guys keep recycling your arguments i might as well do the same.

Really, it's just a waiting game for the guys who haven't voted now.

[TA1LGUNN3R]

vote Haggis

While I find sax suspicious, I don't see how letting Haggis live benefits anyone (but himself of course ). Maybe I'm missing something, but I guess we shall see.

Uhm, because we actually have to make an alliance before i start fighting for you? Right now I'm trying to convince the english guys that what I'm saying makes sense.

You have such a way with words. You make it sound like decent logic, but subtly this seems like a desperate plea to spare your life, as if you're no threat. Kudos to you, Haggis. I'm always impressed with your talents. You make excellent scum.

-Tails

[Haggis_McMutton]

While I find sax suspicious, I don't see how letting Haggis live benefits anyone (but himself of course )

Sigh, let me copy that quote again:

By the same logic, in a 3 player game it's ALWAYS best to eliminate one of the players, no matter what the situation? No because it doesn't matter wether you come in 2nd or you come in 3rd, you still lose.
If you are in the middle strength-wise then it absolutely is a bad move to help the strong guy kill off the weak guy, because guess what, you just killed off your only potential ally and now there's nowhere to hide.

This isn't town vs. scum, this is a faction game. In a faction game it doesn't make sense to team up with the guy stronger than you so you can finish of your last potential ally. And no one has been able to refute this simple fact.

Instead you guys stick your fingers in your ears and go "LA LA LA, YOU'RE NOT ON MY FACTION SO IT'S OBVIOUSLY BEST TO KILL YOU LA LA LA" ...

Now we wait on Fircoal i guess.

[edocsil]

HE wont be around till the 2nd or so, I would disapprove of waiting.