Baseball: King of Diamonds (v15 p.27)

[lostatlimbo]

Wow, this map has come a long way since I last saw it. Looks nice.

Probably two late, but my one comment would be that the arrows by the home runs sort of suggest those might attack each other. I wonder if there is a clearer way to express this?

[Riskismy]

They don't? I assumed that as well.

[natty dread]

What exactly would you suggest?

[Riskismy]

Have it read 'Home Runs' and take away the arrows.

[danfrank]

Such a condescending attitude , dismiss my issue until one confirms it. The game is also annoying that the balls reset to neutral so you infact need to conquer 3 terts to get out of the glove.. Kind of tough in an 8 player game , this fancy map comes down to the luck of the roll..

The ball numbers would also make more sense if they correlated to the position .. Such as the right field ball would be 9 and not eight. But that would make to much sense...

[natty dread]

Such a condescending attitude , dismiss my issue until one confirms it.

I'm sorry if you feel that way. When someone brings up an issue about a map that is visual in nature, particularly an issue that can be dependent on monitors and settings, it is hard to determine whether it is an one-time issue, whether the problem is with the map or that particular person's hardware, or if other people are experiencing similar problems. Particularly, when the mapmakers cannot confirm the problem by themselves, it is reasonable for them to want to hear from more people about the issue, to make sure that the problem is indeed with the map and not the user.

I'm sorry if it hurts your feelings, but in a case like this - especially when the mapmaker cannot confirm the existence of the problem by himself - if one person reports a certain problem, it is still questionable whether there is an issue, but if the same problem is reported by several people, it lends more weight to the complaint.

So you see, it's not about being "condescending" or "elitist" or any of the other things that is often casually flung at a mapmaker's face when he does not instantly provide updates to the map according to every single complaint or suggestion, it's about making certain that every change that is made to the map is a beneficial one. And this can be optimally achieved when the mapmaker tries to receive as many views by as many people as possible for every issue that is brought up.

Either way, thank you for your input, I assure you your feedback is well appreciated. I hope you keep offering your valuable input on this and other beta maps whenever you experience any problems. By doing that you are contributing to the foundry process and helping to make sure that each map becomes as good as it can possibly be and satisfies as many people on CC as is possible.

[shocked439]

I'm not sure if it was intentional or not but much like real baseball you've overvalued the homerun. A +4 bonus would make sense if you held the three bases which imply you actually have a grand slam. Just holding the home run should only be worth 1 + number of bases held.

And you should either increase the starting values of the long ball or decrease the pitchers.

The way it sets up now the field doesn't matter. Get the home run and hold on especially in team or less than 4 player game.

I'm excited to see this evolve.

[soccerghost]

Just in time for Opening Day!! Good Timing!

[Evil DIMwit]

I'm not sure if it was intentional or not but much like real baseball you've overvalued the homerun. A +4 bonus would make sense if you held the three bases which imply you actually have a grand slam. Just holding the home run should only be worth 1 + number of bases held.
[...]
The way it sets up now the field doesn't matter. Get the home run and hold on especially in team or less than 4 player game.

I agree. Something like +2, with an extra +2 per base, might moderate it and force the home run player(s) to be more active in the field.

And you should either increase the starting values of the long ball or decrease the pitchers.

What's your reasoning for this?

[lostatlimbo]

I don't see that this has been addressed yet, but the "Babe" territory is NOT reseting to 2 neutral as stated in the map. Instead it is retaining the previous occupier.

You can see in the game log that both times my opponent and I have attacked Babe it was conquered from the other player.

http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8795457

I also agree with others that the Home Runs are too much, too easy. In my first turn, I was able to own both Home Run territories. Granted, I had great dice and my opponent was able to take one of them back, but it does seem like it could make for some very lopsided games.

$.02

[Gilligan]

I don't see that this has been addressed yet, but the "Babe" territory is NOT reseting to 2 neutral as stated in the map. Instead it is retaining the previous occupier.

You can see in the game log that both times my opponent and I have attacked Babe it was conquered from the other player.

http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=8795457

I also agree with others that the Home Runs are too much, too easy. In my first turn, I was able to own both Home Run territories. Granted, I had great dice and my opponent was able to take one of them back, but it does seem like it could make for some very lopsided games.

$.02

You have to hold it for a full turn for it to reset.

[lostatlimbo]

Shouldn't it... you know... say that?

[drunkmonkey]

Shouldn't it... you know... say that?

Killer Neutrals are explained in the Instructions tab.

[natty dread]

Killer neutrals reset only when the player who holds them starts his turn. So in practice you can keep a killer neutral from resetting indefinitely if at least 2 players keep taking it each turn.

It's the same for all maps and explained in the instructions, so I don't see any reason to waste legend space on it.

[lostatlimbo]

OK. Fair enough.

I thought there were maps that reset every turn (rather than every round, when held), but it seems I'm mistaken on that.

[InnyaFacce]

Evil DIMwit

Game 8789307
Game Settings ::
Doubles
Manual
Freestyle
No Spoils
Unlimited
Foggy

we did not even get a turn after the Manual Deployment in Round 1
i really think that the MOUND needs to be set at a higher number
possibly set at 25 NEUTRALS to avoid super lucky dice syndrome
or
the PITCHERS need to start with less troops

here is the game log ......

2011-03-29 22:41:02 - Game has been initialized
2011-03-29 22:41:08 - TheShiningSun began deploying initial troops
2011-03-29 22:41:09 - TheShiningSun ended the turn
2011-03-29 22:41:11 - donination began deploying initial troops
2011-03-29 22:41:11 - donination ended the turn
2011-03-29 22:46:29 - InnyaFacce began deploying initial troops
2011-03-29 22:46:30 - InnyaFacce ended the turn
2011-03-29 22:46:57 - Ninja Champion began deploying initial troops
2011-03-29 22:46:57 - Ninja Champion ended the turn
2011-03-29 22:46:57 - Incrementing game to round 2
2011-03-29 22:55:40 - TheShiningSun got bonus of 2 troops added to Bob
2011-03-29 22:55:40 - TheShiningSun got bonus of 2 troops added to Satchel
2011-03-29 22:55:40 - TheShiningSun received 3 troops for 2 regions
2011-03-29 22:55:46 - donination got bonus of 2 troops added to Nolan
2011-03-29 22:55:46 - donination got bonus of 2 troops added to Cy
2011-03-29 22:55:46 - donination received 3 troops for 2 regions
2011-03-29 22:55:49 - donination deployed 3 troops on Nolan
2011-03-29 22:55:50 - donination assaulted Babe from Nolan and conquered it from neutral player
2011-03-29 22:55:53 - TheShiningSun deployed 3 troops on Babe
2011-03-29 22:55:56 - TheShiningSun reinforced Babe with 13 troops from Bob
2011-03-29 22:55:58 - TheShiningSun reinforced Babe with 13 troops from Satchel
2011-03-29 22:55:59 - TheShiningSun ended the turn
2011-03-29 22:56:00 - donination assaulted Ball 9 from Babe and conquered it from neutral player
2011-03-29 22:56:04 - donination assaulted CD1 from Ball 9 and conquered it from neutral player
2011-03-29 22:56:07 - donination assaulted Mound from CD1 and conquered it from neutral player
2011-03-29 22:56:10 - donination bombarded Sandy from Mound and annihilated InnyaFacce's troops
2011-03-29 22:56:15 - donination bombarded Dennis from Mound and annihilated InnyaFacce's troops
2011-03-29 22:56:15 - donination eliminated InnyaFacce from the game
2011-03-29 22:56:18 - donination bombarded Greg from Mound and annihilated Ninja Champion's troops
2011-03-29 22:56:22 - donination bombarded Lefty from Mound and annihilated Ninja Champion's troops
2011-03-29 22:56:22 - donination eliminated Ninja Champion from the game
2011-03-29 22:56:22 - TheShiningSun, donination won the game

donination got bonus of 2 troops added to Nolan
donination deployed 3 troops on Nolan
donination assaulted Babe from Nolan and conquered it from neutral player
TheShiningSun deployed 3 troops on Babe
TheShiningSun reinforced Babe with 13 troops from Bob
TheShiningSun reinforced Babe with 13 troops from Satchel
TheShiningSun ended the turn
even with perfect dice ...
43 troops should not usually beat 66 defenders
and .... have 10 troops left when finished

Thanks
InnyaFacce

[natty dread]

Ugh, freestyle... I would be inclined to say that stuff like that is just inherent to freestyle games, but I might be biased about the issue, so I'll let others comment on this one...

[InnyaFacce]

I also think that the Bases should be set higher
to also avoid 1 turn games played in Freestyle mode

[Evil DIMwit]

I don't see that this has been addressed yet, but the "Babe" territory is NOT reseting to 2 neutral as stated in the map. Instead it is retaining the previous occupier.

Killer neutral territories only reset if they are held by a player at the start of that player's turn. Since you keep alternately conquering the territory, neither of you is starting your turn owning the territory, and it doesn't reset.

[shocked439]

I'm not sure if it was intentional or not but much like real baseball you've overvalued the homerun. A +4 bonus would make sense if you held the three bases which imply you actually have a grand slam. Just holding the home run should only be worth 1 + number of bases held.
[...]
The way it sets up now the field doesn't matter. Get the home run and hold on especially in team or less than 4 player game.

I agree. Something like +2, with an extra +2 per base, might moderate it and force the home run player(s) to be more active in the field.

And you should either increase the starting values of the long ball or decrease the pitchers.

What's your reasoning for this?

I like your home run idea. My reasoning behind the pitchers and the home run is to even out the game. Right now in a two player game the first player has a chance to take the home run and reinforce 14 troops to it. Meaning they have a plus 4 bonus and two pitchers with 16 troops to take both home runs and player 2 is screwed. In 4 player games the first two players will hold the home runs with the last two having little chance. If you reduce the pitchers or increase the home run so it is more difficult for the first player to take and hold it will balance the game. Another option would be to limit starting positions to 1 or two so players have to be more conservative in smaller games.

[ender516]

The new XML feature limiting the number of starting positions per player might be a good addition in this setup.

[Evil DIMwit]

Oh, heck yes. What do you say, limit of one or of two?

[carlpgoodrich]

I would be inclined to say 1 if for no other reason than to limit the freestyle scenario InnyaFacce described above.

I also agree the home runs need to be tweaked. I like the +2 with +2 extra per base idea, although I still think the neutral value could be raised to 8 or 9. I think the goal should be to make sure people don't go for the home runs on their first turn.

[40kguy]

I think this is a allaround good map, i think the mound could be raised, because jsn and me one in round 1 or two both times.

[shocked439]

Oh, heck yes. What do you say, limit of one or of two?

I would think limiting it to one would make the map more difficult and more fun to play. Less troops to start with means you'll have to be smarter with them. Strategies will switch to working from the outfield to build bonuses instead of going balls out for homers. It's an improvement on this one for sure which ever way you go.