Pokemon Endgame: Mafia Victory + jonty

[naxus]

Here's the way I see it. Fissk is obviously either scum or 3rd party. He's not town unless he's a moron. Secondly, that 's not how a lyncher works, so either Fissk is trying to read the wiki and infer how or Yoshi is being weird with his setup. I don't see any reason to keep Fissk around. By learning whether his claim is true or not we can infer what the mafia thought of him as. If he was a lyncher, the mafia would have seen him as town, and thusly the prime bandwagonners should be under suspicion. Honestly I think this lynch should happen just to see this information.

Then hammer fir

[kratos644]

Here's the way I see it. Fissk is obviously either scum or 3rd party. He's not town unless he's a moron. Secondly, that 's not how a lyncher works, so either Fissk is trying to read the wiki and infer how or Yoshi is being weird with his setup. I don't see any reason to keep Fissk around. By learning whether his claim is true or not we can infer what the mafia thought of him as. If he was a lyncher, the mafia would have seen him as town, and thusly the prime bandwagonners should be under suspicion. Honestly I think this lynch should happen just to see this information.

That's why I changed my vote. If he turns up scum then AOG is clearly next on the lynching list.

So who wants to hammer?

[naxus]

unvote
someone else vote and then Ill hammer just to get this moving again

[Fircoal]

Here's the way I see it. Fissk is obviously either scum or 3rd party. He's not town unless he's a moron. Secondly, that 's not how a lyncher works, so either Fissk is trying to read the wiki and infer how or Yoshi is being weird with his setup. I don't see any reason to keep Fissk around. By learning whether his claim is true or not we can infer what the mafia thought of him as. If he was a lyncher, the mafia would have seen him as town, and thusly the prime bandwagonners should be under suspicion. Honestly I think this lynch should happen just to see this information.

Then hammer fir

This is a group game. Thusly I'd like to hear more of the group, specifically those that are the more experienced.

[Mr. Squirrel]

unvote
someone else vote and then Ill hammer just to get this moving again

What purpose does this serve?

[naxus]

unvote
someone else vote and then Ill hammer just to get this moving again

What purpose does this serve?

Makes me the hammer cause it seems like no else wants to

[Rodion]

unvote
someone else vote and then Ill hammer just to get this moving again

What purpose does this serve?

Getting bomb-killed, perhaps?

[DoomYoshi]

Vote Count:

Fircoal (1) - shieldgenerator7
Army of God (1) - Streaker
kratos644 (1) - Army of God
jonty125 (1) - nagerous
Mr. Squirrel (1) - sheepofdumb
nagerous (1) - Fircoal
TheFissk (9) - Victor Sullivan, Rodion, ???, shaggydan, kratos644, jonty125, jimfinn, freezie, evilchaos

With 21 alive it takes 11 to lynch

I would like to point out that there are unique roles in the game.

[Commander9]

Okay, I'm going to re-read in the few days and post something. Apologies to all, but I've been somewhat busy and the few posts that I did do this week went to the games which were already under way and where my posts were needed.

[evilchaos]

We have a "???" vote on TheFissk.
Perhaps there's a doublevoter out there?

If there is we need to find out who!

Hank hasn't posted in several days. This increases my suspicions regarding him. His strange statements and then complete absense is sketchy.

[evilchaos]

EBWOP: http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 0#p3164220

There's the link to his last post.

[freezie]

I'd like to point out that I am all willing to lynch a lyncher, as it's not exactly a pro-town role and won't help us find scum anyway..

HOWEVER, a lyncher is NOT a mafia on it's own..And personally I doubt a mafia lyncher would be a good idea of a role..

A lyncher generally works alone, so lynching AoG simply because he defended fissk on the basis that AoG is his scumate is worthless.

I would vote AoG purely cause I don't like his actions so far..but linked to a lyncher? Doubtful.

[evilchaos]

That's one of the reasons I don't think Fissk is a lyncher. Why would people defend a lyncher? Fissk so far has defended Nag and Hank at separate times (either through his vote or his posts). He's also been defended by Nag and AoG. Why would so many people be associated with him if he's actually a 3rd party role with no associates?

I think he should be lynched either way. Lyncher isn't pro-town, so we don't have to worry about lynching a townie. The information we get from his lynch (i.e. whether or not he is lyncher or scum) will help us find the remaining scum. If he comes back as scum, then we need to take a close look at AoG.

[ShaggyDan]

That's one of the reasons I don't think Fissk is a lyncher. Why would people defend a lyncher? Fissk so far has defended Nag and Hank at separate times (either through his vote or his posts). He's also been defended by Nag and AoG. Why would so many people be associated with him if he's actually a 3rd party role with no associates?

I think he should be lynched either way. Lyncher isn't pro-town, so we don't have to worry about lynching a townie. The information we get from his lynch (i.e. whether or not he is lyncher or scum) will help us find the remaining scum. If he comes back as scum, then we need to take a close look at AoG.

It would be in the best interest for a lyncher to defend anyone who's not their target (assuming they can do so without looking scummy themselves). The people defending him may just be town with a different view on things.

I agree with the last paragraph. I'm struggling to think of a situation where having a lyncher around would be useful, even a lyncher survivor. I imagine if his target dies, and he's not end-gamed, that we wouldn't be told. Leaves too much room for him to lie and say his target died when they're still alive and then present a case against a regular townie. Better to get rid of him now IMO.

The only way I can see this being a bad thing for town is if he fake-claimed and is really a town power role or something. But I think the chances of that are very, very low.

My vote remains where it is.

[shieldgenerator7]

I see the Fissk BW has revved up.
I will abstain my vote until deadline approaches or he does something out of the ordinary.
I think he's just acting n00bish.

[Army of GOD]

FOS ShaggyDan, that logic is pretty misleading and you're leaving out a lot.

[Rodion]

FOS ShaggyDan, that logic is pretty misleading and you're leaving out a lot.

Please elaborate.

[evilchaos]

FOS ShaggyDan, that logic is pretty misleading and you're leaving out a lot.

FoS AoG. You have yet to give any reason for defending Fissk. If you don't think that what he has done is scummy, then that's fine, but please support what you're saying if you're going to FOS every person who says anything about him.

It would be in the best interest for a lyncher to defend anyone who's not their target (assuming they can do so without looking scummy themselves). The people defending him may just be town with a different view on things.

I hadn't thought of it that way. That makes quite a bit more sense now. I'll have to read through everything he's posted again and try to see how beneficial it would be from a lyncher standpoint.

The only way I can see this being a bad thing for town is if he fake-claimed and is really a town power role or something. But I think the chances of that are very, very low.

The chances are microscopic. Why would a cop/doctor/etc have acted the way he has? I guess it could be inexperience, but I would think most people as doc/cop would lay low, even without much knowledge of the game and game theory.

[kratos644]

Can we just lynch AOG? The fact that he's FOSing everyone for no reason is getting old. He would probably FOS me for this post if he didn't already vote me because I didn't like that his original vote came without reading the thread at all.

[ShaggyDan]

FOS ShaggyDan, that logic is pretty misleading and you're leaving out a lot.

Please explain how my logic is misleading. He's admitted to being third party with a win-condition that is anti-town (in a sense he doesn't need to kill all the scum to win).

As for what I'm leaving out: If I were to believe his claim (which tbh I'm not sure if I do or not yet) he still openly admits that he's a third party with a win-condition that means he won't actively be trying to help us genuinely scum-hunt. If all he has to do is survive and kill this one person I imagine he's going to be tunnel-visioned on this one person (as far as making cases go). I would also assume his target is town (not ruling out a scum target, I just think it's unlikely). Everyone is going to come under pressure at least once throughout the game, when his target comes up I imagine he would lay on the pressure hard to try and get them lynched. For him to win we have to lose a townie, and I imagine he's going to do what he can to win.

There's enough reasons there to lynch him even if I believe the claim. As I think the claim is pretty shakey it makes my decision easy. What he has claimed is a survivor that has to make it to the end as well as getting a certain player killed. That sounds like an incredibly tough wincon, I find it hard to believe (though not impossible), normally people are just given survivor or lyncher roles.

If I don't believe the claim then I have to logically conclude he is scum. The only reason he would fakeclaim as town would be if he was a very strong role, in which case he should have outed himself anyway and could be protected tonight.

Therefore if we lynch him there are 3 possible scenarios;

1. He's a lyncher. Killing him helps town.
2. He's lieing scum. Killing him helps town.
3. He's a lieing power role. Chances of this are very, very small, and he's played it terribly if he is.

That enough of an explanation? Now could you please explain your FOS as well as the many other FOS you've thrown around with very little explanation?

[Army of GOD]

That has nothing to do with anything.

[ShaggyDan]

That has nothing to do with anything.

You FOS for my 'misleading logic', I explained my vote. So I'm fairly sure it has everything to do with why I'm voting and subsequently your suspiscion of me.

I'm not sure if you're a noob, a troll, or just very bad scum. Either way until you explain your FOS on me (and others) as well as explain how what I posted back to you is irrelevant you earn a mighty big FOS on AOG from me. If this is how you're going to continually bring forward cases I have no problem voting for you.

[kratos644]

I'm upping my FOS to the dramatic HOS on AOG
Anyway the question still sits at do we lynch fissk and use the information from his death scene to determine the next course of action or should we turn the pressure up on AOG?

[Streaker]

I'm upping my FOS to the dramatic HOS on AOG
Anyway the question still sits at do we lynch fissk and use the information from his death scene to determine the next course of action or should we turn the pressure up on AOG?

Well, we'll lynch the claimed lyncher and see what happens. There is plenty to go around, twice, for Day 2. AoG being top dog for a Day 2 investigation no matter Fissk's lynch outcome.

Unvote if needed, Vote Fissk

[Rodion]

I'm upping my FOS to the dramatic HOS on AOG
Anyway the question still sits at do we lynch fissk and use the information from his death scene to determine the next course of action or should we turn the pressure up on AOG?

Well, we'll lynch the claimed lyncher and see what happens. There is plenty to go around, twice, for Day 2. AoG being top dog for a Day 2 investigation no matter Fissk's lynch outcome.

Unvote if needed, Vote Fissk

Unless Fissk flips "town mason". Then you don't waste your investigation on AoG.