If homosexuality is a choice...

[Tupence]

I assume you're straight; did you know that before you had sex?

Why do you assume this?

Because most people on this site are.

[KernowWarrior]

I assume you're straight; did you know that before you had sex?

Why do you assume this?

Because most people on this site are.

Why do you assume this?

[Tupence]

I assume you're straight; did you know that before you had sex?

Why do you assume this?

Because most people on this site are.

Why do you assume this?

Because most people in general are, and in a competitive fighting environment like this site, you are more likely to find straight men.

[KernowWarrior]

I assume you're straight; did you know that before you had sex?

Why do you assume this?

Because most people on this site are.

Why do you assume this?

Because most people in general are, and in a competitive fighting environment like this site, you are more likely to find straight men.

I agree that statisticlly only 1 in 10 members would be gay, as is the general population, as for the fact that its a competitive fighting environment thats a bit if a steriotypical view of gay people.

Following your logic, everyone on here would be lesbians!

I wouldn't consider this sight as a competitive fighting enviornment, its a competitive game of strategy, theres no actual fighting involved!

Again following your logic, chess would be banned in schools because its too violent.

[Tupence]

I agree that statisticlly only 1 in 10 members would be gay, as is the general population, as for the fact that its a competitive fighting environment thats a bit if a steriotypical view of gay people.

Following your logic, everyone on here would be lesbians!

I wouldn't consider this sight as a competitive fighting enviornment, its a competitive game of strategy, theres no acual fighting involved!

Again following your logic, chess would be banned in schools because its too violent.

That whole chess thing is ridiculous. Yes there are gay rugby players, and straight male ballet dancers etc, but most stereotypes have an element of truth in them.

[natty dread]

most stereotypes have an element of truth in them.

No they don't. You only think they do because the stereotypes have been ingrained in your psyche.

[thegreekdog]

most stereotypes have an element of truth in them.

No they don't. You only think they do because the stereotypes have been ingrained in your psyche.

Then where do the stereotypes come from? Magic? Thin air? Life forces? Racist and bigoted straight, white men who want to remain in power?

Let me stereotype Greek Americans - Greek Americans are swarthy, hairy people who own diners. Stereotypes? Yes. i know Greeks who are not dark-skinned, who have little body hair, and who don't own diners. But are there no elements of truth there? Was it just ingrained in the American psyche by some random people?

[Johnny Rockets]

most stereotypes have an element of truth in them.

No they don't. You only think they do because the stereotypes have been ingrained in your psyche.

Yeah, I'll call bullshit on that as well. Stereotypes are not formed out of thin air. They are at worst a caricature of common traits, behaviors, and preferences of a specific group of people.
It's not 100% accurate by any means, but there is a significant baseline of fact in them.

Johnny Rockets

[KernowWarrior]

I agree that statisticlly only 1 in 10 members would be gay, as is the general population, as for the fact that its a competitive fighting environment thats a bit if a steriotypical view of gay people.

Following your logic, everyone on here would be lesbians!

I wouldn't consider this sight as a competitive fighting enviornment, its a competitive game of strategy, theres no acual fighting involved!

Again following your logic, chess would be banned in schools because its too violent.

That whole chess thing is ridiculous. Yes there are gay rugby players, and straight male ballet dancers etc, but most stereotypes have an element of truth in them.

Of course that whole chess thing is ridiculous, that was the point!

[natty dread]

It depends. Sometimes stereotypes correlate to a large portion of the targeted people, other times they are just plain false. People aren't always rational: superstitions, prejudices, rumours, old wives tales, all can affect to stereotypes - most people don't really question what they "know", they just hear something from a friend of a friend and consider it to be true. Even more so if the stereotypes are perpetuated by authority figures, media, parents, etc.

[Tupence]

It depends. Sometimes stereotypes correlate to a large portion of the targeted people, other times they are just plain false. People aren't always rational: superstitions, prejudices, rumours, old wives tales, all can affect to stereotypes - most people don't really question what they "know", they just hear something from a friend of a friend and consider it to be true. Even more so if the stereotypes are perpetuated by authority figures, media, parents, etc.

Do you have a more valid opinion on the accuracy of a stereotype if you are in the minority group yourself?

[thegreekdog]

It depends. Sometimes stereotypes correlate to a large portion of the targeted people, other times they are just plain false. People aren't always rational: superstitions, prejudices, rumours, old wives tales, all can affect to stereotypes - most people don't really question what they "know", they just hear something from a friend of a friend and consider it to be true. Even more so if the stereotypes are perpetuated by authority figures, media, parents, etc.

Do you have a more valid opinion on the accuracy of a stereotype if you are in the minority group yourself?

For what it's worth, my grandfather owned a diner and my entire family is filled with swarthy, hairy individuals.

[natty dread]

It depends. Sometimes stereotypes correlate to a large portion of the targeted people, other times they are just plain false. People aren't always rational: superstitions, prejudices, rumours, old wives tales, all can affect to stereotypes - most people don't really question what they "know", they just hear something from a friend of a friend and consider it to be true. Even more so if the stereotypes are perpetuated by authority figures, media, parents, etc.

Do you have a more valid opinion on the accuracy of a stereotype if you are in the minority group yourself?

It depends. Which minority group are you in?

[Tupence]

It depends. Sometimes stereotypes correlate to a large portion of the targeted people, other times they are just plain false. People aren't always rational: superstitions, prejudices, rumours, old wives tales, all can affect to stereotypes - most people don't really question what they "know", they just hear something from a friend of a friend and consider it to be true. Even more so if the stereotypes are perpetuated by authority figures, media, parents, etc.

Do you have a more valid opinion on the accuracy of a stereotype if you are in the minority group yourself?

It depends. Which minority group are you in?

Why does that make a difference?

[PLAYER57832]

Its a good point. The difference has to do with why the stereotype originated. For example, the stereotype to which greekdog referred arose because a significant number of greeks came here, found that they could make money by selling food. These kinds of trends were not cooincidental. One family might come and be successful, then use their experience to help newer immigrants. Soemtimes this was unofficial sometimes more officially through fraternal organizations. This happens even today with the Chinese retaurants. We have a Chinese restaurant here in town, for example, that keeps changing hands, but always to another recently immigrated Chinese family. They advertise through the Chinese papers. They come here, because its small and the set up is relatively inexpensive, but when they accumulate more money, then they move on to a bigger location. The same thing happened out west with dry cleaners and restaurants. In other cases, similar connections might help someone just get a job in a particular specialty. I think the Irish had a dominance in New York Fire fighting, for example. Pakistani definitely have a dominance in cab driving now.

However, a lot of stereotypes are just about knocking the other group down. The idea that blacks are dumb and lazy came partly because in times of slavery and then Jim Crow, anyone showing more intelligence or ability outside of narrow confines would get knocked down. So, it was based on the "reality" of what whites saw, but that "reality" was based on a needed pretense.

Similarly, Jews became money lenders in the middle ages because the Christian church saw taking a profit on loans as "usery" and not allowed. People hate money lenders anyway, so the two sort of combined. A Christian who saved his money was seen differently than a Jew, because that was what people wanted to see. At the same time, Jews did band together, did devlope traning in good business.

When it comes to homosexuals, you get into a whole other realm of false perceptions. The REAL truth is that most of the stereotypes applied to men and women are just false. Some stereotypes are either based on cultural need, such as the idea of women tending just the house arising from a time when it took a good part of the day just to get the water, stoke the fire, cook and sew. This was juxtaposed by the idea of wealth meaning no work. For a man, that meant power over more people. For a woman that meant they were mostly an ornament (across many cultures). Ironically, these stereotypes often conflict. For example, the victorian "dollhouse" model more or less cooincided with the stereotype of the strong prairie farmwife.

The real truth is that three have always been men who were more fastidious than others, women who have been physicaly strong.

Having been around a fair number of homosexuals, I do think there is a slight difference, but it is something far more subtle than the idea that lesbians are "butch" and gays are "effeminent". Instead, I think its more than people who are not bound by traditional sexual lines.. are just not bound by sexual stereotypes.

I see this a lot in kids. When I was young, I can remember several fathers being upset because there were only dolls in the church nursery and no real "boy" toys. Wehn the tool boxes arrived, they were new and I (about the only girl at the time), naturally wanted to play with them and could not understand why it was not quite OK. I loved dolls, it was not that, but the new toys, was, well.. new. Today, most of the boys I have play with tea sets, pretend cook and play with dolls. A few dads question this, but I always ask them, "Do you cook?" (tend the baby, etc.) They ivariably say "sometimes, yes". I think say "well, your son is just copying you." That IS the truth.

[jimboston]

I assume you're straight; did you know that before you had sex?

Why do you assume this?

Because most people on this site are.

More people in the real world are "straight" too.

Why do you think most people on CC are straight and not gay?
Have you done a poll?

[Tupence]

I assume you're straight; did you know that before you had sex?

Why do you assume this?

Because most people on this site are.

More people in the real world are "straight" too.

Why do you think most people on CC are straight and not gay?
Have you done a poll?

If you read the rest of the thread, I also said that most people in the real world are straight.

[jimboston]

Because most people in general are...

Valid and correct.

and in a competitive fighting environment like this site, you are more likely to find straight men.

Why do you assume this?
Gay men don't like competition and strategy?
Women don't like competition and strategy?

[jimboston]

Some stereotypes have elements of truth in them... how strong / accurate those truths are vary wildly based on the specific stereotype in question.

I disagree with the stereotype that says straight men are more likely (than non-straight men) to enjoy "manly" physical activities and things related to these "manly" activities... i.e. sports, war, strategy, fighting, weight lifting, etc.

I do agree that gay men are more likely to enjoy "womanly" activities like dancing and plays.

These statements are NOT mutually exclusive or contradictory.

[Tupence]

Because most people in general are...

Valid and correct.

and in a competitive fighting environment like this site, you are more likely to find straight men.

Why do you assume this?
Gay men don't like competition and strategy?
Women don't like competition and strategy?

From my experience, gay men and women are less likely to be into competition and strategy.

[Tupence]

Some stereotypes have elements of truth in them... how strong / accurate those truths are vary wildly based on the specific stereotype in question.

I disagree with the stereotype that says straight men are more likely (than non-straight men) to enjoy "manly" physical activities and things related to these "manly" activities... i.e. sports, war, strategy, fighting, weight lifting, etc.

I do agree that gay men are more likely to enjoy "womanly" activities like dancing and plays.

These statements are NOT mutually exclusive or contradictory.

So are you saying that non-straight men are more likely to enjoy a wider variety of activities than straight men? I agree that that may be true, and the accuracy of stereotypes does vary.

[jimboston]

Some stereotypes have elements of truth in them... how strong / accurate those truths are vary wildly based on the specific stereotype in question.

I disagree with the stereotype that says straight men are more likely (than non-straight men) to enjoy "manly" physical activities and things related to these "manly" activities... i.e. sports, war, strategy, fighting, weight lifting, etc.

I do agree that gay men are more likely to enjoy "womanly" activities like dancing and plays.

These statements are NOT mutually exclusive or contradictory.

So are you saying that non-straight men are more likely to enjoy a wider variety of activities than straight men? I agree that that may be true, and the accuracy of stereotypes does vary.

Possibly yes... because gay men are maybe less likely to care if an activity is considered "feminine"... they will still be willing to explore it, maybe more-so than your typical hetero male.

[jimboston]

Because most people in general are...

Valid and correct.

and in a competitive fighting environment like this site, you are more likely to find straight men.

Why do you assume this?
Gay men don't like competition and strategy?
Women don't like competition and strategy?

From my experience, gay men and women are less likely to be into competition and strategy.

You need more experience.

... or maybe you are just assuming people here are men (when they may be women)... and you are assume people here are straight (when they might be not-straight).

Then by assuming someone here is straight (mistakenly so in some cases)... you are validating your pre-conceived notions.

[Tupence]

Because most people in general are...

Valid and correct.

and in a competitive fighting environment like this site, you are more likely to find straight men.

Why do you assume this?
Gay men don't like competition and strategy?
Women don't like competition and strategy?

From my experience, gay men and women are less likely to be into competition and strategy.

You need more experience.

... or maybe you are just assuming people here are men (when they may be women)... and you are assume people here are straight (when they might be not-straight).

Then by assuming someone here is straight (mistakenly so in some cases)... you are validating your pre-conceived notions.

I'm not basing it on people on the site, I'm basing it on people that I know and have known in real life, both straight and non-straight.

[KernowWarrior]

Because most people in general are...

Valid and correct.

and in a competitive fighting environment like this site, you are more likely to find straight men.

Why do you assume this?
Gay men don't like competition and strategy?
Women don't like competition and strategy?

From my experience, gay men and women are less likely to be into competition and strategy.

From my experience women see everything as competition and strategy. lol