Appalachian Trail

[jcarter1]

I would like to create a map with the theme "Appalachian Trail". At least the americans inhere should know what that is. If not: google it. A little info: The Appalachian Trail is a over 2000 mile long hiking path through the eastern United States. It passes through 14 states and is between 124 ft and 6643 ft (source: wikipedia) high. It has several entry points and many unique and famous spots along its path.

General thoughts:
I do not want to make this a super easy and straight forward map. I want to encourage strategic thinking/playing. I would like to include around 22 states (maybe split those up into territories even) and figure out a good way of grouping them together into bonus zones (or if they are split up into regions: each state by itself is a bonus zone). The trail itself will be divided into several (maybe around 30) different zones - each can be taken by an army (similar to rail maps or route66 for example). Some zones can be entered by their adjacent states/regions - but definitely not all of them. Chokepoints (Springer Mountain, Harpers Ferry, Mt. Kathadin and more) could be special areas.. for example with auto deploy +1 or +2.. where as other regions (for example in the north where lots of bears are) will be -1 per turn.

The idea is that each player has a save "home" area (like the baseball map for example) - i still have to figure out whether and how that area would be attackable by other players (to take a player out). Maybe I will just make it impossible to take out a player - but that could lead to boring and useless fights once a game is decided. Suggestions here are welcome! From there the players could deploy into the different starting points on the trail (no idea how many yet - but i think around 8 sounds good - those fields could be neutrals at the start of each round). In order to win the game, you will have to hold the complete trail for one round.

Here is an idea of how the map could look like:

http://www.verinav.com/HiResImages/Half ... %20Map.jpg

Obviously taking out lots of the text etc and making it playable with inserting those circles for the numbers of troops and so on. There are two things I am interested in here:

1) I am no good at making graphics - i can contribute to the game dynamics and i can do the XML file once everything else has been decided.

2) game dynamics - ideas about how to make this map fun and challenging at the same time are more than welcome

[jcarter1]

20 views and no replies... i guess thats not a good sign

[ironsij0287]

It'd be good if you could show us a better example of how the map would work. Even if its a crude graphical drawing or something. Right now the description is somewhat vague.

Seems like the game play would be similar to Route 66 but there would be actual bonus regions in it rather than just a network of roads (or in this case trails).

[VicFontaine]

I think this is a great idea. I'm willing to help on the design, but not the code-writing, which I know nothing about and don't have time to learn. Where do we start?

[lostatlimbo]

As an avid hiker I love this idea and would be happy to help!

If it pans out, there could also be a Pacific Crest Trail map in the same style. Maybe Continental Divide Trail too.

PM me if you want some help on this. I could make a mockup to start visualizing the gameplay concept.

[ironsij0287]

Looks like you got some folks eager to help get this map off the ground.

[jcarter1]

This is great - thanks guys. I have been doing some tutorials in GIMP over the last few days to provide you with a graphical idea of the game... i guess we will be able to go from there once I have it.

JC

[jcarter1]

i created a very basic picture just so you guys have something to look at:



The blue circles are the starting regions of each player

The red circles are two entry points to the trail (will likely need more of them later on)

The two states (Georgia and Maine) with the red circles are special - they should be split into 8 different regions

Each of these regions can attack the red circle inside their state

I have not yet decided whether the regions can attack one another as well or not

A player can drop from his home into either one of those 2x8 regions (either north or south of the trail)





This is what i got so far... all the ideas from my first post are still possibilities. The main focus right now is on the gameplay aspect. What can/should be implemented/left out to make this fun/exciting/challenging? (see my first post)


JC

[VicFontaine]

This is an excellent starting point. I know along the AT ("AT" = Appalachian Trail) there are terrific touristy sights, i.e., splendid views, historic towns or battle sites, etc. Several of these should be incorporated and would make excellent +1's. They'd have to be accessed directly from the AT rather than from another point. In other words, it'd work great for you to have to leave "home," get on the AT, and work up to one of these locations. They shouldn't be too easy to access, though, unless there's just no way around it. Perhaps if there's one quite a bit off the AT, you could make it a +2 to compensate for the distance it takes to get it.

Moreover, holding a major city along the AT (e.g., Hartford, CT, though I know Hartford is miles away from the AT directly, on a map this size, it would LOOK very close and could count as a bonus of, say, +2) could be an attractive and additional bonus. Atlanta could be one, though it's more southerly than the opening of the trail. You get my gist, I'm sure. Others, perhaps: Philly, NYC, Concord (NH), Augusta (ME), Baltimore (MD), Wash. D.C., these are some other ideas. Again, I know they aren't all next to the Trail, and I'm sure you don't want (neither would I) another USA Cities-oriented map, but I'm trying to think of smaller bonuses that could make gameplay constantly changing, fun, and add different objectives for a victory condition:

"Hold 5 major cities, 1 minor (like Concord, NH), and 1 end point of the AT for victory."

[VicFontaine]

Another thought: this map might be BEST as a slug-it-out fest, i.e., no major bonuses (nothing like a +5, or +7 continent bonus), but many smaller ones. The only downside I see, and I may be wrong, would be if one person gets the upper hand and is collecting +10 in smaller bonuses: no one would then have a chance to make a dent in the board leader's terts because there is no larger bonus. Perhaps escalating spoils would change things, but for the vast numbers of players (like me) who prefer no spoils, could be a non-starter. Just tossing things up.

[lostatlimbo]

To me, the big draw to hiking the AT is being away from the cities, so having cities as bonuses doesn't seem in tune with the concept of the map.

I think it would be more fun to highlight things you might actually see on the AT - like black bears, lynx, moose, porcupine, copperheads, etc. (more examples here: http://www.trailquest.net/ATWILDLIFE.html)

As far as gameplay, I think a map about the AT needs bonuses for things like food & water. Doing any long-distance hike like this requires advanced planning of where you can resupply for those vital resources. Or, perhaps you could lose troops for not always holding one of each?

The AT is also known for its lean-to shelters. Have you considered using those along the trail as starting points, rather than off map starting points?

Have you read Bill Bryson's 'A Walk in the Woods'? Its a great book about his time on the trail and might be a good source of inspiration for this map.

Jcarter - I've been working on a "National Parks of North America" map for my next project and I'm wondering if it would fit well with the trail maps. It could be fun to eventually build a super map that highlights the AT, PCT, CDT and the associated national parks along the way. Let me know if you'd like to collab on this.

[lostatlimbo]

Here's some info about the lean-tos. There are a LOT of them, but you could probably get away with picking one for each state or a particular distance along the trail.

http://web.eecs.utk.edu/~dunigan/at/

I do hope you move further away from the states around the trail and make this about the actual trail itself. I think there are many opportunities to make this unique.

[VicFontaine]

To me, the big draw to hiking the AT is being away from the cities, so having cities as bonuses doesn't seem in tune with the concept of the map.

I think it would be more fun to highlight things you might actually see on the AT - like black bears, lynx, moose, porcupine, copperheads, etc. (more examples here: http://www.trailquest.net/ATWILDLIFE.html)

As far as gameplay, I think a map about the AT needs bonuses for things like food & water. Doing any long-distance hike like this requires advanced planning of where you can resupply for those vital resources. Or, perhaps you could lose troops for not always holding one of each?

Great ideas. With one catch: Part of hiking the AT and other such places is, at least, the SMALLER little towns you find along the way. Some of these are real historical and American treasures, preserving history in the present as "living-history" without even meaning to, i.e., these places just haven't changed in 150 years, "Why, I remember when the stop light in town went up in 1975" kind of thing.

Some of those places would be very cool on the map.

[lostatlimbo]

To me, the big draw to hiking the AT is being away from the cities, so having cities as bonuses doesn't seem in tune with the concept of the map.

I think it would be more fun to highlight things you might actually see on the AT - like black bears, lynx, moose, porcupine, copperheads, etc. (more examples here: http://www.trailquest.net/ATWILDLIFE.html)

As far as gameplay, I think a map about the AT needs bonuses for things like food & water. Doing any long-distance hike like this requires advanced planning of where you can resupply for those vital resources. Or, perhaps you could lose troops for not always holding one of each?

Great ideas. With one catch: Part of hiking the AT and other such places is, at least, the SMALLER little towns you find along the way. Some of these are real historical and American treasures, preserving history in the present as "living-history" without even meaning to, i.e., these places just haven't changed in 150 years, "Why, I remember when the stop light in town went up in 1975" kind of thing.

Some of those places would be very cool on the map.

On that, I can agree. I was referring to your suggestion of including metropolitan areas like Hartford.

Generally, I just hope that the presence of states/cities/borders/etc is more of a background element, rather than a key part of the gameplay.

[VicFontaine]

Makes sense. I agree. J?

[jcarter1]

Thanks for the great input guys. I completely agree not to honor big outside city bonuses too much and i would definitely want to make the trail itself the most important feature of this map (that goes to an extent that i would agree abandoning outside bonuses from states etc. completely if we come up with a better idea - like the idea of having to hold certain things like food/water/other supplies).

The idea with collaborating for a big map - once all the others are done - definitely sounds like something that should be done. I see no reason why anyone would be against that.

Oh - i also read Bill Bryson's Walk in the Woods that you mentioned earlier... i read it in a matter of days, very well written, entertaining and interesting.


I will think about all this for a little while and see what I can come up with. You guys are very welcome to bring further input to the table if you have any. I think this will work out nicely.

[MoB Deadly]

maybe if you hold a certain "length" of the trail the bonus gets bigger and bigger. Similar to Conquer 4, 4 in a row gets you 1 bonus, but 5-6 in a row could grant a bigger bonus

[VicFontaine]

maybe if you hold a certain "length" of the trail the bonus gets bigger and bigger. Similar to Conquer 4, 4 in a row gets you 1 bonus, but 5-6 in a row could grant a bigger bonus

That's sort of what I was suggesting earlier, but I'd be concerned about the board getting out of hand very quickly: if the bonuses are all small bonuses (like +1's, +1 autos or +2 autos), then it could be over quickly if someone gets a lucky drop.

To some extent, this is a risk on any board, but perhaps gameplay beta would reveal the real weakness of it one way over another.

[jcarter1]

In the current setup of the game there are no lucky drops Vic - everyone starts at home (see baseball map as reference).

The length idea is definitely possible MoB - i just want to make sure this map doesnt become too similar to Route66 where they have the same feature. I think we can achieve that difference with the supply idea from above - just have to figure out how that would work exactly.


This means we would end up with some small bonus zones (+1 - +2), some auto deploys (+1 - +2), some negative auto deploys (-1 until down to 1 troop), some bonuses for holding certain supply fields (+x depending on what is being held) and some bonuses depending directly on how many zones of the trail are being held in a row.

[VicFontaine]

That sounds like it would work very well.

[lostatlimbo]

Hello, just had an interesting thought for this map.

If you exclude small sections by college clubs, the AT is divided into 16 sections by which local volunteer organizations work to maintain the trail and the shelters in their region.

16 is a great number for starting positions. Each player could start as a handful of these clubs and fight to hold the whole trail?

Here are the organizations (per the national park service):

Georgia AT Club
Smoky Mntn Club
Carolina Mntn Club
Tennessee Eastman Hiking Club
Piedmont AT Trail Hikers
Roanoke AT Club
Natural Bridge AT Club
Potomac AT Club
Mountain Club of Maryland
Blue MT Eagle Climing Club
NY/NJ Trail Conference
Connecticut AT Club
Berkshire AT Club
Green Mntn Club
Appalachian Mntn Club
Main AT Club

[VicFontaine]

Might be good for those to be bonuses, and keep the original 8 spots OFF the trail. Makes more logical sense (as the clubs are seeking to protect the trail, they wouldn't fight).

?