[Official]Adventure time mafia:MAFIA WIN!

[TimWoodbury]

white rrose your leading town to lynches and ur still alive are you alive because your helping skum or are you alive because your skum

[the white rose]

I suspect that i am alive cos pixar without good cause claimed watcher. totally stupid of him, no surprise that he was killed as he could have identified scum, i cannot, wish i could.

if you still have lingering doubts about me, don't forget the confirmed cop cleared me....so if i were scum you would need a bus driver and an explanation why i lynched dakky on d1 from l-2. Sure scum lynch scum, even hammer them on occasions but never with a concealed double vote, that would be sheer madness.

Streaker did accept a ludricous claim from dakky that made him look scum, and it was wing himself who switched from you to him to hammer, which ultimately got him lynched.

whoever is scum is playing very well, which leads me to PT. No real case to build on him, just a feeling that an experienced player is keeping well in the background.

wing's dying words were that he was wrong about pt, need to look back and see why he said that and what did he mean?

[ptlowe]

Im going to have to review from day 1. Based on play pixar seemed like scum. He didnt even tell us who he tracked n1 and why the claim he basically targeted himself without a need....

twr....if there is anyway that mitchs read got screwed we are screwed...your fights with streaker and wing are the rewson they both were lynched.

Going to have to review reageb. Be back on the hunt tonight

[TimWoodbury]

yah im starting to question if mitches read got squed somehow

[the white rose]

well thats silly, i was not the only one to vote these 2, they appeared scummy so i voted along with others.

Your fixation on me is making me think that maybe wing was right.....my best bet now is tim and pt/soldier....but i am not confident enough to lead a charge against them just yet, think i need to reread again!

[Soldier4Christ]

well thats silly, i was not the only one to vote these 2, they appeared scummy so i voted along with others.

Your fixation on me is making me think that maybe wing was right.....my best bet now is tim and pt/soldier....but i am not confident enough to lead a charge against them just yet, think i need to reread again!

Actually you are the only one who voted for both. Not counting PIX ofcourse, who was killed. When does "voting along with the others" become not enough?

[the white rose]

perhaps...but i had good reason to vote for them both.

I am sure scum would love you all to lynch me today, but hold off you will look very silly after i was cleared by the cop.

For that to be wrong there must be a bus driver, if you think i am scum, then lets find the bus driver then you can lynch me.

I doubt very much there is a bus driver and there is not much point in having a cop if you don't believe him.

its gonna get to the stage that i dare not scum hunt cos if i am wrong i get lynched.

I may be all that town has left now, if we mislynch today then tomorrow will be lylo, and we still have 2 to find.

PT, the reason wing and streaker both got lynched is cos they tried to lynch the only confirmed town role, that was too scummy to be town...

[Whatsausage]

perhaps...but i had good reason to vote for them both.

I am sure scum would love you all to lynch me today, but hold off you will look very silly after i was cleared by the cop.

For that to be wrong there must be a bus driver, if you think i am scum, then lets find the bus driver then you can lynch me.

I doubt very much there is a bus driver and there is not much point in having a cop if you don't believe him.

its gonna get to the stage that i dare not scum hunt cos if i am wrong i get lynched.

I may be all that town has left now, if we mislynch today then tomorrow will be lylo, and we still have 2 to find.

PT, the reason wing and streaker both got lynched is cos they tried to lynch the only confirmed town role, that was too scummy to be town...

I don't recall streaker or wing making a push to lynch you. They accused you of being scummy yes, but they conceded that there should be evidence of a bad investigation before you could be lynched. If you are in fact scum, this is incredibly handicapping the town, since now we are searching for (assuming 3 total) just one scum instead of two. It's also possible that if this is the case, then the other scum is hiding in hotshot or soldier. This would create a scenario where everyone talking is either town or "confirmed" town. You are free to scum hunt without fear of being wrong (other than we are running out of chances) but you were in fact imperative in the lynching of both streaker and wing. They did each make a mistake, (streaker unvoting dakky, wing hammering streaker) but the point you have chosen to bring up for their lynching is that they looked at you.
So let's ignore the investigation for a second. (I realize that the investigation is a factor, but it isn't 100% evidence, so reads can and should be made aside from it.) Now look at this scenario: There is a double voter. He is questioned by two players. Both of these players get lynched after this double voter puts them at L-1. (I don't remember at what point you voted for streaker, but you were on him and posting after he was at L-1.) These players are both lynched and flip town. Now, does the double voter look town or scum in this scenario?

I am not convicted that you are scum twr, but if a mafia busdriver or tailor flips, I will have to take a long, hard look at you. You need to understand that PT or other players considering you does not make them scum. A good player will leave his options open and be willing to make reads beyond night actions that could be misleading. You leaving your vote on wing after he claimed jailor and was not counterclaimed could easily be read as a scum move, as scum would definitely want a jailor gone by a lynch, as a jailor could stop a kill in two different ways.

You said (probably as a joke) that scum have kept you alive so you can keep lynching town, but I would argue that they have kept you alive because people (mitch and Pixar) KEPT CLAIMING PRs for NO REASON. If there was ever a game to show why that is a bad idea, this would be it.

I don't understand either why wing backed off of PT. Perhaps it's because PT didn't vote for him yesterday.

D3 final VC:
Wing(4)ragian,hotshot53,TWR,pixar
Soldier4Christ(2)Timwoodbury,ptlowe
Timwoodbury(2)Whatsausage,wing

D2 final VC:
Timwoodbury(4)streaker,whatsausage,pixar,ragian
Streaker(5)Ptlowe,thewhiterose,madmitch,Timwoodbury,WingCmdr

D1 final VC:
Whatsausage?(1)soldier
Thewhiterose(1)subtleknifewield
Dakky21(6)IB,madmitch,Streaker,timwoodbury,ragian,thewhiterose
Streaker(1)wing
Madmitch(3)hotshot,whatsausage,dakky21
IronButterfly(1)Ptlowe

I have pasted the final VC's of each day above and replaced the replaced player's names and colored the names of the deceased. I don't know how much can really be gleaned from this, but if I run scenarios on what I would expect from "typical" VC scum placement, I think it reflects poorly on Tim and ragian. They both joined the dakky vote once time was running down and it became likely that dakky would be the lynch- a "safe" place to hide/distance oneself. On D2, the two remaining scum would likely want to distance themselves from each other, as can be seen in ragian voting tim. Tim's vote is more likely just omgus here. Then on D3, I would expect a scum to come right out and chase wing for hammering town. Tim comes straight out voting wing. He then changes his vote after ragian votes wing in his first (real) post of the day. Is this logic going off the deep end? I could see scum spending the whole game trying to separate from each other, and that is what these two have done.

Pt has spent the last two days voting alongside Tim, and I don't suspect that they would do that if they were scum mates.

Perhaps I am viewing the above logic with tinted glasses or overthinking it, but I believe these patterns are consistent, and this along with wing's calling ragian out before death makes these our two scum. Ragian hasn't really been pushed yet, so I will Vote Ragian, but I would also be happy to lynch Tim first if that's what everyone would prefer.

[ptlowe]

the theory was to do with dakky, based on him getting very nervous early on when he attracted 4 joke votes....left me wondering about him.....and based on that looked at the way others interacted with him....that ultimately led to me switching my vote to dakky making him l-1. from there i looked to see who was trying to save him.....my theory has worked well so far even though it now seems to have fallen on deaf ears.

I have worked hard to analyse postings made.....my previous post summarizes my findings, they may or may not be supported but there they are unless and until someone else convinces me otherwise, either through persuasion or making the same sort of mistake that you made.

Peculiar, because at the time of your post there was only 1 vote on Dakky... by Mitch if I recall. You must mean the joke votes on dakky PRIOR to game start. Dakky made a single response to that:

Exactly, voting me while the game didn't even start isn't really fair.

A little defensive there dakky, I'd say there are more joke votes on you than normal, but it is incredibly early to be nervous about it.

Agreed, though it never happened to me that during joke stage I get four consecutive joke votes

After this the day started, votes are reset, and it's not mentioned again. Surely if you were really looking at dakky, you would have followed that post up with a case on him. But you didn't, you directed your attention to mitch mostly and only at the very end of the wagon do something with dakky. And you almost instantly unvoted him, too.

I'm calling it right now, white rose mafia godfather.

Let's pressure cyaniteer into a claim first, or alternatively have him replaced in the game, and then push towards a white rose lynch.

fp'd by wing. Let's hear your thoughts on my reasoning here, wing.

Godfather
A Godfather is a role that investigates as Innocent (or some other favorable result) to Cops, regardless of their actual alignment.

Godfather is a name given exclusively to Mafia members. Serial Killers with investigation immunity are simply called "investigation-immune".


I've been going back through everything...only on page 11....two really goes after streak and wing. I think streaker had some insight. I've felt like two has been mafia this whole game but because of mitch I never went with my gut. I didn't even know what a mafia godfather was till 2 minutes ago. I think his scum partner is either rage or soldier....I will keep looking the part that throws my idea out the door is the double vote. I'm not sure if you would have a double vote and be godfather..

[the white rose]

Let me explain again.

the reasons i voted streaker

although i hammered dakky with a double vote, no one but me new that. Dakky made an obvious bogus claim which prompted streaker to unvote him to get him away from l-1. this was done within 2 minutes of dakky's claim before anyone else had a chance to hammer him. Like i said, it was only I that knew he had already been lynched.

the reason for voting wing.

wing's vote was on first on me, but by now my double vote and therefore the hammering of dakky was known. wing's argument was that i had been bus driven. when this got no support he switched his vote to tim, claiming him as the bus driver. I was on streaker for reasons as stated above, and that meant that both tim and streaker were at l-1. It appeared that no-one was prepared to move their vote, so i posted that i would switch my vote from streaker to tim to hammer tim, not because i believed him scum but to prove him town, tim had already posted that if he is lynched then wing must be scum.

then wing under the threat that i was about to lynch tim, unvoted him, but with my double vote this was not enough to save tim, the only thing wing could do to save him was to vote streaker and hammer him, which is exactly what he did.

That night we lost our claimed cop, wing claimed jailer the following day, but did not use his powers to save our cop. its true that mitch would not have been able to investigate anyone but it would have meant a safe night with no kills had he had jailed him. wing is a good experienced player and if he were town, this is appallingly bad play from him, so he must have been scum.....why as an experienced town player he played that way i really do not know.

Moving forward, wing jailed pt but that did not prevent the night kill, which while not exactly clears him, but it does leave him less likely to be scum.

My number one choice today is Tim for 2 reasons.

1. wing was always seeing him as scum
2. he was testing the waters at the start of today 'beginning to wonder whether cop's investigation on me was scewed"

Clearly if I were scum, scum would need another power role to mislead the cop. Rather than take the risk on lynching me it would make more sense to hunt the other scum first, and if he does not have any special powers that clears me completely. After all, we need to find 2 scum, lynch me first and even if i were scum you would still need to find the bus driver, find the bus driver first and its a town win as i would not be able to defend myself.

I am not scum, and that will be proved when we lynch a scum today. I had good reasons for voting both streaker and wing. Having a double vote means i am always likely to be on the lynched player. today will only need 2 others to agree with me to lynch someone....however, i am aware that with 2 scum left, should they both vote for the same townie i could be invited to hammer, and more importantly, if i were to vote now and be wrong the 2 scums could together hammer whoever i voted, therefore i will refrain from voting until everyone else has. I would also urge town not to make someone l-2 as it gives an invitation for scum to quick hammer someone.

[ptlowe]

vote hotshot

Hes just been coasting. Havent really seen him help at all. Also im still not sold on twr...but for now ill look elsewhere. The one thing ive been thinking is what if twr isnt a double voter but someone ia voting with him who is. Going to need your help thia game sausage if twr is scum. The only three i see being able to influence this game enough are me sausage and twr....hotshot and soldier arent doing jack...twr keeps influencing town lynches and tim seems oblivious. Rage is interesting still working on that read. I think one mafua between solder and hotshot and one between rage and twr

[ptlowe]

unvote

I put soldier l-1 and twr unvotes....then he kills wing...

[the white rose]

White Rose are you the doublevoter? If not Cyan has just been lynched.

Congratulations guys, how about you actually ask questions next time. Lynching someone without attempting to gain evidence is the stupidest thing you can do.

this was where i was confirmed as doublevoter, cyan at the time was on l-1 with everyone who lynched dakky on him except me, had the double voter been on him, he would have been lynched....dakky was lynched with a double voter on him, so it follows that the double voter had to be me.....elementary my dear pt.

[Ragian]

I can understand that the "easy" move (especially scum move) would be to go for me, but any experienced players should realise that it's unfruitful for town. Or at least make a case.

I have pasted the final VC's of each day above and replaced the replaced player's names and colored the names of the deceased. I don't know how much can really be gleaned from this, but if I run scenarios on what I would expect from "typical" VC scum placement, I think it reflects poorly on Tim and ragian. They both joined the dakky vote once time was running down and it became likely that dakky would be the lynch- a "safe" place to hide/distance oneself. On D2, the two remaining scum would likely want to distance themselves from each other, as can be seen in ragian voting tim. Tim's vote is more likely just omgus here. Then on D3, I would expect a scum to come right out and chase wing for hammering town. Tim comes straight out voting wing. He then changes his vote after ragian votes wing in his first (real) post of the day. Is this logic going off the deep end? I could see scum spending the whole game trying to separate from each other, and that is what these two have done.

Perhaps I am viewing the above logic with tinted glasses or overthinking it, but I believe these patterns are consistent, and this along with wing's calling ragian out before death makes these our two scum. Ragian hasn't really been pushed yet, so I will Vote Ragian, but I would also be happy to lynch Tim first if that's what everyone would prefer.

33% of Sausage's case is that I haven't been pressured before. The main reason being that most have found me towny (or more scummy players were available). The next 33% of the case if that Wing screamed my name when we dragged him to the hangman's noose. While it is always wise to look at the wrongfully strung up, one should also regard the context. I carried the case from the get-go of D3. I didn't sneak in last second because I'm scum knowing who's town. I made a (to me anyway) convincing case that several people felt was strong enough to lynch wing.

The last 33% (and arguably the only scumhunting work actually done by Sausage) consist of the following facts:
1) That I joined the wagon when time was running out (I assume there's a "throwing inevitably dying scummate under the bus to look town" in there).
2) That I voted Tim because I wanted to distance myself from my scummate.
3) That I made a case on Wing (which Sausage disregards completely, he calls it chasing).

Re: 1, I'm almost certain that I was one of the first to point to dakky's slip D1. Here's some evidence:

This game looks like no one is going to make a case, except maybe kratos on White Rose, but I'm going to follow his lead FOR now and

vote rose

Also, mitch looks scummy, and not because I always vote him, for real, his posts this game are scummy.

And yet you vote White Rose. Why are you following someones lead and voting when out of your own mouth you say Mitch is scummy?

Pretty much crapola to go with on day one.

vote dakky

This was never addressed by Dakky and went pretty much ignored. I find it odd that several folks mention it and find it odd then people start obsessing about stupid crap.
Raigan and Streaker were like yup its scummy...yest several others dont even make mention.

Dakky never addressed it either.

While I didn't throw my vote after him immediately, I still put on record that he acted scummily. Your statement about me not pointing to dakky until it was too late is untrue. Especially if you factor in the fact that I wanted to go for a non-contributor which several people agreed was a decent idea, but then returned to where we had seen a scummy move.

Re: 2, this pretty much hinges on me being scummy D1. I am adament that the above shows that I was not, but merely put my vote where my mouth was. Surely, I can't be held accountable for what Tim does.

Re: 3, Well, I make cases when I can. I felt there was a case on Wing, you feel there's a case on me. What's the difference?

I'm interested in seeing how others feel about Sausage's vote and case on me.

[TimWoodbury]

iim interested in ragian i forgot bout twr being the doublevote i cant imagine there would be a double vote godfarther so lets jsut call him confirmed town for now and move past twr

[Soldier4Christ]

Tim, why would you post about his reading being possibly skewed..all that is is an attempt to defer suspicion off of you

[HotShot53]

Sorry for not checking in sooner this day, with the releases of Fallout 4 and Battlefront almost together as they were, I'm afraid a lot of my time recently seems to have disappeared.

Looking at the reads I made yesterday, I still think the same (other than wing obviously)... so by process of elimination I'd have to rate soldier4christ as most scummy as he is the only one I wasn't leaning town on. I'd go with tim as second likeliest to be scum, but with s4c's post just now it seems less likely they'd be scum buddies. Both of them started off questioning TWR, which seems a bit scummy as TWR is about as confirmed of a towny as you can get at this point. S4C's posts seemingly implying guilt on TWR for bandwagonning, and then in the next post attacking tim for suggesting the investigation on TWR might have gotten skewed seems a bit odd to me. Those kind of indirect attacks are something that scum often like to do, to attack but not really leading from the front so they don't take the heat like TWR is getting today. So I will vote Soldier4Christ

[Endgame422]

Official Vote Count
Ragian(1)-Whatsausage
Hotshot53(1) ptlowe
Soldier4christ(1)-hotshot53
With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch

[Ragian]

iim interested in ragian i forgot bout twr being the doublevote i cant imagine there would be a double vote godfarther so lets jsut call him confirmed town for now and move past twr

This is a good point about TWR. Can't believe I never thought of that...

How interested in me are you, Tim? Care to vote and put your money where you mouth is?

[TimWoodbury]

because it would be l-2 id really hate to have you lynched before being able to talk some. biggest thing is you so far was on all 3 lynches could be coincediance and im assumeing your a smarrt guy and a smart guy would know not to bring attention to themselves(yah its some wifom here i know)

[the white rose]

because it would be l-2 id really hate to have you lynched before being able to talk some. biggest thing is you so far was on all 3 lynches could be coincediance and im assumeing your a smarrt guy and a smart guy would know not to bring attention to themselves(yah its some wifom here i know)

not sticking up for ragian here, but actually you are wrong, he was not on streaker on day 2, he was on you, that made you and streaker taking into account my double vote, both at l-1, you got lynched cos wing switched his vote

I was the only one on all 3 lynches, but that is not surprising with a double vote

[the white rose]

hmm, no new posts today, thats disappointing, my double vote is weighing heavily on my mind, and i really do not know who to vote for.

My thoughts are on Tim, but only because wing and streaker saw him as scummy, PT, an experienced player not really helping to find scum and staying in the background....soldier both he and his predecessor have looked scummy and cyan even refused to claim at l-1, when i had a chance to lynch him....beginning to wonder now whether i should have.

Sausage seems more town to me, has been very helpful, ragian has played on looking town for pressurising dakky on D1 but not convinced he is....and that leaves hotshot who has stayed under the radar for the most part, is that scummy? i really do not know, think i am at a big disadvantage in that i have not played with anyone of you before so cannot compare your game play.

I dare not vote unless i am prepared to see someone get lynched, if my vote is wrong, scum could easily quick hammer and i will look even more suspicious.

[ptlowe]

hmm, no new posts today, thats disappointing, my double vote is weighing heavily on my mind, and i really do not know who to vote for.

My thoughts are on Tim, but only because wing and streaker saw him as scummy, PT, an experienced player not really helping to find scum and staying in the background....soldier both he and his predecessor have looked scummy and cyan even refused to claim at l-1, when i had a chance to lynch him....beginning to wonder now whether i should have.

Sausage seems more town to me, has been very helpful, ragian has played on looking town for pressurising dakky on D1 but not convinced he is....and that leaves hotshot who has stayed under the radar for the most part, is that scummy? i really do not know, think i am at a big disadvantage in that i have not played with anyone of you before so cannot compare your game play.

I dare not vote unless i am prepared to see someone get lynched, if my vote is wrong, scum could easily quick hammer and i will look even more suspicious.

We must get mafia today. If we don't it will be 3v2 tomorrow with next kill being do or die. I'm willing to go after soldier today. I don't see him adding up as town play. Not a lot either way going on with that play but cyan play was definitely weird at best. I think that's our best bet today.

unvoted vote soldier

[the white rose]

if we do get it wrong today, then i will surely be killed tonight.

as pt says it will then be 3 v 2 which means no townie should vote until its decided who to lynch, just one town vote on another town player will give scum chance for a quick hammer and the win.

in fact come to think of it even if we get it right today, i will be nk'd and it will be 4v1 tomorrow, then get it wrong tomorrow then the day after it will be lylo again. Its looking like wing was our only protective role.

[Endgame422]

Official Vote Count
Ragian(1)-Whatsausage
Soldier4christ(2)-hotshot53,ptlowe
With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch deadline is to be november 28th