INTO THE DEEP (COMPLETE - Mafia Win !!)

[Pikanchion]

But I didn't target TX, I ended up there because of the mass redirection. This time he was named, unlike in night 2 where I was redirected (by Tobi as the evidence would suggest now), my new target was not named.

What was your action? Nothing happened to me.

Then you don't need to know, do you? Let's mass claim in an sensibly ordered fashion instead of trying to get claims out of confirmed Town first...

How come no one has claimed to be a pufferfish?

Maybe they're waiting for the mass claim, maybe they're Scum.

Who is in favour of a mass claim?

[Ragian]

I'm in favour of a mass claim.

I'm fine with blacky going first, but if I were allowed to choose, I'd have picked chap.

[Sirius Kase]

I want the puffer fish to claim. Mainly to prove that Blacky didn't just make it up.

[TX AG 90]

But I didn't target TX, I ended up there because of the mass redirection. This time he was named, unlike in night 2 where I was redirected (by Tobi as the evidence would suggest now), my new target was not named.

What was your action? Nothing happened to me.

Then you don't need to know, do you? Let's mass claim in an sensibly ordered fashion instead of trying to get claims out of confirmed Town first...

How come no one has claimed to be a pufferfish?

Maybe they're waiting for the mass claim, maybe they're Scum.

Who is in favour of a mass claim?

Can we stop with the automatic BJ is confirmed town? He was pointed at as being town by 1 dead guy and we didn't have the ability to question aage about it. So, we don't know for sure. For all we know, aage may have been mistaken and scum killed him that night to cement his story. You and BJ may be a scum team using the opportunity tho throw us all off.

Likely Town, yes. Confirmed - NO!

[TX AG 90]

I'm in favour of a mass claim.

I'm fine with blacky going first, but if I were allowed to choose, I'd have picked chap.

Let's decide whether to do the mass claim 1st and THEN decide who goes 1st.

Pika, this is your baby - tally the votes for all that are in favor (or at least unopposed) and let's get this ball rolling.

[Skoffin]

I'm still against the idea as proposed because it removes all the fun of playing the game. If we are to mass claim now then we should all just go when we happen to be online.

But if I were to pick someone - I vote me, my claim will be the most fun.

[Skoffin]

I'm starting to see TX's point regarding buj not being clear, but I still don't like it.

vote skoffin

[Pikanchion]

I'm still against the idea as proposed because it removes all the fun of playing the game. If we are to mass claim now then we should all just go when we happen to be online.

don't know why people still underestimate Dakky, he has proven himself capable already. It's also kind of funny that on LyLo he talked all of you from doing a mass claim and no one gave him any sort of flak for it. lololol Well done mate.

:thinking:

[Skoffin]

What game was that?
I'm okay with mass claiming I just don't like your method of doing it. I'm also not sure if we are at lylo yet
But it's all cool I voted for myself anyway

[Skoffin]

unvote vote chap


I'm just going to claim soon then if no one object

[TX AG 90]

I'm starting to see TX's point regarding buj not being clear, but I still don't like it.

vote skoffin

Don't like what?

[Razorvich]

[blacky365]

So pikas plan looks like it has failed and not getting the attention it needs... can we get back to good old fashioned scum hunting?

[BuJaber]

If you say so.

I would vote chap, but strike I think brought up the fact that Blacky claimed to have needed one night to rest after he got poisoned, he was unable to use his action.

I was poisoned and healed but I was able to use my action successfully. I got told no such thing about needing to rest.
He had time to address this when strike and I were talking about it but he failed to do so.

So I think blacky wasn't poisoned in the first place.

Regardless though I believe ragian and think we have to lynch one or blacky or chap in any case.

Vote: Blacky

[Pikanchion]

blacky365 was poisoned unless chapcrap lied about who was bussed or there's a second buss driver.

[Sirius Kase]

we know aage was town and what his role should do? look I don't know i'm not a scientist

So, in his role as a silencer, we think he found out that BuJ was without a doubt town? You're right, I actually do have science degrees and that sounds nothing like science. Sounds like speculation.

Your whole case on BuJ lying rests on you saying it can only be from a 3rd poisoner yet you haven't offered any reasoning as to why.
And I for one have no idea what a grave robber does, and I don't see how you can be certain it can't get any investigative-type results. You see, my role name (town drug addict) comes from the fact that my favorite food is fish, especially puffer-fish, which gets me high. It gives no information on what my night actions are. It might be the same thing with a grave robber, I can't tell.

I haven't said it yet (and it's pretty irrelevant), but my specie is the dolphin (bottlenose dolphin to be exact).

Found it! puffer fish, but in a different context. I knew I'd seen it before. But, do players prey on other players? Have you gone for favorite food, ZaBeast? Did you get high?

[Ragian]

Why hasn't Pika's thing panned out again?

[Sirius Kase]

So pikas plan looks like it has failed and not getting the attention it needs... can we get back to good old fashioned scum hunting?

But Pika's database has been quite useful at organizing disorganized minds, and motivating some of us to come out and provide information. Sure, it organizes information, but even more importantly, it makes obvious what we don't know. Blacky and BuJ have not claimed at all. Well, blacky claims to have investigated Skoffin, but there is no evidence at all that he didn't make that up. Then there is BuJ who seems to be skating along on the endorsement of the long dead Aage that he be Town. Blacky was strongly endorsed as confirmed town by the even longer dead jfm. jfm was a confirmed liar. We trusted Aage, but I can't recall why.

If these players voluntarily make a believable claim, we don't need that plan, we just need to start a lynch train on Blacky or BuJ. Blacky is playing like someone who knows he's in trouble, anything he says will surely be vetted, but BuJ has seemed rather smug and comfortable. What is his role, NA, etc? I'm suspecting it might conflict with what Aage said, otherwise he would have said it. So, I'll promise to think the worst of him until he says something.

[strike wolf]

Buns explanation for how he was healed matches up almost 100% with how it was written in my night result.

Unless I was busdriven/redirected to the one actually poisoned, Blacky was indeed poisoned. Something odd happened wirh my vision night 2 but nothing that specifically indicated that I visited someone other than who I meant to target and no one else has claimed being poisoned at that time other than TX who at the very least attempted to heal himself according to his claim. There was suggestion that Tx's action should have been redirected but no one has claimed anything that would make my action redirected. The discrepancy between the role block vs not role blocked is strange however and even stranger that he's claiming it took him 4 nights to get a workable night action result. This at the least needs more pressure. That's why I feel Blacky should start us off on the mass claim.

[Pikanchion]

Why hasn't Pika's thing panned out again?

Presumably because around 40% of the remaining players are working together and know that a mass claim done correctly will be very bad for them? All it takes is those (presumably) four players to convince one other onto their side or two onto the fence and it's a split vote on if we mass claim.

—

So pikas plan looks like it has failed and not getting the attention it needs... can we get back to good old fashioned scum hunting?

But Pika's database has been quite useful at organizing disorganized minds, and motivating some of us to come out and provide information. Sure, it organizes information, but even more importantly, it makes obvious what we don't know. Blacky and BuJ have not claimed at all. Well, blacky claims to have investigated Skoffin, but there is no evidence at all that he didn't make that up. Then there is BuJ who seems to be skating along on the endorsement of the long dead Aage that he be Town. Blacky was strongly endorsed as confirmed town by the even longer dead jfm. jfm was a confirmed liar. We trusted Aage, but I can't recall why.

You literally just explained why we believe aage and not jfm10, aage is confirmed Town and did not constantly lie, jfm10 is also confirmed Town but lied in every second post. The implications of the blacky365 statement in particular were contradictory to other statements made by jfm10 at the time, and was made before we knew anything about ZaBeast or chapcrap's roles which would further complicate things even if jfm10 had a legitimate, logically consistent reason to make that statement. Besides, I have also claimed to have verified BuJaber's alignment.

If these players voluntarily make a believable claim, we don't need that plan, we just need to start a lynch train on Blacky or BuJ. Blacky is playing like someone who knows he's in trouble, anything he says will surely be vetted, but BuJ has seemed rather smug and comfortable. What is his role, NA, etc? I'm suspecting it might conflict with what Aage said, otherwise he would have said it. So, I'll promise to think the worst of him until he says something.

BuJaber hasn't claimed because there is no reason for BuJaber to claim unless we mass claim, blacky365 has already effectively claimed Species & Night Action Role Cop.

We will probably learn far more from claims of what actions were performed on which night than by simple claims of role details at this point, but there's no obvious reason not to claim things like Species or the official names of Night Action Roles or role Titles, especially when some of these are the things for which Scum are almost certain to have to lie in claiming and most Town can claim truthfully at little to no cost.

[TX AG 90]

So pikas plan looks like it has failed and not getting the attention it needs... can we get back to good old fashioned scum hunting?

Blacky was strongly endorsed as confirmed town by the even longer dead jfm.

This started me thinking along the lines of WHY jfm presumed blacky was Town. At first I thought it was HOPE because he would get credits if he poisoned a townie AND that townie was healed. Now I'm thinking jfm was told by the MOD in his N1 results that he poisoned a townie and would receive credits if that townie was healed (but it wasn't blacky ).

OK, if you remember from my post awhile ago when I fully claimed and pointed the finger at blacky and SW as a scum team and then backed off based on no further proof, I laid out what happened with jfm N1 and why he thought what he did at the time. Here is a summary of that (w/o quotes like I provided before) that showed proof that I was the one he poisoned.

1. jfm targeted me N1 for poisoning - he was going for Credits, not trying to help town win. (maybe he thought it was win/win - poison scum and it helps town, poison town and they get healed and he gets credits - who knows with that guy)
2. He ASSUMED it was blacky because I never claimed to be poisoned (I knew I could heal myself and saw no reason to disclose my role at that time)
3. He pointed the finger at me as redirector because he tried to poison me and he thought it landed on blacky - Remember, he mentioned in the post that his victim and target were different (he was wrong of course)

Therefore, if the Mod provided jfm info that he poisoned a townie and since I was the one he poisoned, this provides evidence that I am town. I know that it is not 100% unassailable proof from Y'alls perspective, but it should help those of you sitting on the fence post regarding my alignment.

[Pikanchion]

I asked the mod about End Game Bonus credits (as at least one of my end game credit bonuses relies upon the alignment of another player, effectively turning that bonus into a free Cop result if triggered) and was told that players will only be informed about whether they were successful in completing any upon the game's conclusion so I have doubts as to jfm10 truly knowing for certain about any player's alignment unless it was a standard part of the role. A poisoning Vigilante who is also a Cop seems rather unlikely to me.

[TX AG 90]

I asked the mod about End Game Bonus credits (as at least one of my end game credit bonuses relies upon the alignment of another player, effectively turning that bonus into a free Cop result if triggered) and was told that players will only be informed about whether they were successful in completing any upon the game's conclusion so I have doubts as to jfm10 truly knowing for certain about any player's alignment unless it was a standard part of the role. A poisoning Vigilante who is also a Cop seems rather unlikely to me.

Makes sense. I guess he was just speculating (hoping) then.

[Sirius Kase]

I asked the mod about End Game Bonus credits (as at least one of my end game credit bonuses relies upon the alignment of another player, effectively turning that bonus into a free Cop result if triggered) and was told that players will only be informed about whether they were successful in completing any upon the game's conclusion so I have doubts as to jfm10 truly knowing for certain about any player's alignment unless it was a standard part of the role. A poisoning Vigilante who is also a Cop seems rather unlikely to me.

Makes sense. I guess he was just speculating (hoping) then.

Possibly his last remaining chance to influence the game. Maybe gambling for credits for helping a poisoned townie get healed. He didn't have to know Blacky's alignment to figure out that it was in his interest to help him get healed.

[Sirius Kase]

If these players voluntarily make a believable claim, we don't need that plan, we just need to start a lynch train on Blacky or BuJ. Blacky is playing like someone who knows he's in trouble, anything he says will surely be vetted, but BuJ has seemed rather smug and comfortable. What is his role, NA, etc? I'm suspecting it might conflict with what Aage said, otherwise he would have said it. So, I'll promise to think the worst of him until he says something.

BuJaber hasn't claimed because there is no reason for BuJaber to claim unless we mass claim, blacky365 has already effectively claimed Species & Night Action Role Cop.

We will probably learn far more from claims of what actions were performed on which night than by simple claims of role details at this point, but there's no obvious reason not to claim things like Species or the official names of Night Action Roles or role Titles, especially when some of these are the things for which Scum are almost certain to have to lie in claiming and most Town can claim truthfully at little to no cost.

I mentioned Blacky because he thought he was investigating Skoffin, but she immediately denied it. His investigation could have been redirected or something. But, it casts some doubt. There might be a pufferfish in the game and Blacky might be a cop, but I'm not ready to play follow the cop with him, not yet.

BuJaber, all I know about him, that he is town, is what I know through you. I'd like to know more about BuJaber directly. We know less about him than any other player.

So, in my mind trusting BuJaber is linked to trusting Pika. I'm convinced Pika is a wiretapper, or was for at least that one night, but I'm not convinced whose side you are on. And I don't know if you are always a wiretapper. That's close enough to being a cop that we should be letting you lead, assuming you are town.

So, we have Pika wiretapper and Blacky the maybe cop. Who do we trust?