Israel

[Votanic]

Sure, why not?
That album cover is basically just an ersatz outtake from Jesus Christ Superstar.

[bigtoughralf]

The Chinese government has reiterated its calls for an immediate ceasefire in Gaza and the implementation of a two-state solution with Israel accepting Palestine's sovereignty:

https://www.reuters.com/world/china-wan ... 024-05-30/

On one side: the UN, ICJ, EU, China, the world's NGOs, the vast majority of world governments etc.

On the other side: Israel, the Israeli media, Israeli Twitter users, and Pack Rat.

[Pack Rat]

China needs to think about a multi-State solution within it's own absurd territorial claims.

FREE TIBET!

What about Chinese genocide of Muslims?

[bigtoughralf]

FREE TIBET!

FREE HAWAII!

I agree re the Chinese government's suppression of Islam in Xinjiang but this isn't the thread for it and in any case the Chinese are at least refraining from bombing Urumqi, Kashgar, Turpan etc flat and strafing aid convoys in the process.

Imagine that, the Israeli government's atrocities are actually worse than the Chinese ones you were just criticising.

[Pack Rat]

FREE TIBET!

FREE HAWAII!

I agree re the Chinese government's suppression of Islam in Xinjiang but this isn't the thread for it and in any case the Chinese are at least refraining from bombing Urumqi, Kashgar, Turpan etc flat and strafing aid convoys in the process.

Imagine that, the Israeli government's atrocities are actually worse than the Chinese ones you were just criticising.

China is being accused of genocide and throwing the Muslims (who are still breathing) in concentration camps.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-22278037

[bigtoughralf]

The word genocide isn't being used as a reference to killing people there.

Either way the Chinese government started its campaign in response to a series of terror attacks. Are you now saying that a government's response to terror attacks should be proportionate and that 'we're responding to terror attacks' is not a justification for killing civilians and committing crimes against humanity?

[bigtoughralf]

So far today the IDF has killed 53 Gazan civilians during its assault on Rafah, including 47 killed when their refugee camp tents were bombed:

https://aje.io/u2jqo6?update=2936979

[Pack Rat]

The word genocide isn't being used as a reference to killing people there.

Either way the Chinese government started its campaign in response to a series of terror attacks. Are you now saying that a government's response to terror attacks should be proportionate and that 'we're responding to terror attacks' is not a justification for killing civilians and committing crimes against humanity?

Yes, I believe that is what you are saying.

[bigtoughralf]

I already explicitly said I support neither government's actions. How about you?

[Pack Rat]

I already explicitly said I support neither government's actions. How about you?

I said, release all hostages both alive and dead. Agree first to have Red Cross check on any surviving hostages and tally the dead among the hostages. Otherwise, no truce, no negotiations.

[Votanic]

I already explicitly said I support neither government's actions. How about you?

I said, release all hostages both alive and dead. Agree first to have Red Cross check on any surviving hostages and tally the dead among the hostages. Otherwise, no truce, no negotiations.

It sounds like Hamas needs to take additional 'fresh' hostages, so they'll have more to bargain with.

[Pack Rat]

I already explicitly said I support neither government's actions. How about you?

I said, release all hostages both alive and dead. Agree first to have Red Cross check on any surviving hostages and tally the dead among the hostages. Otherwise, no truce, no negotiations.

It sounds like Hamas needs to take additional 'fresh' hostages, so they'll have more to bargain with.

Hamas has plenty of human shields/hostages. They are called Palestinian civilians.

[bigtoughralf]

Over the course of today the Israeli government has:

• Attacked a massive refugee camp, reducing it to rubble
• Attacked the Red Cross, killing two medics
• Officially accused the UN of being a terrorist organisation
• Been publicly criticised by the US Government for illegally closing all border crossings into Palestine, making it harder than ever for Palestinians to access food, medicine or water

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog ... d-in-rafah

[Pack Rat]

Over the course of today the Israeli government has:

• Attacked a massive refugee camp, reducing it to rubble
• Attacked the Red Cross, killing two medics
• Officially accused the UN of being a terrorist organisation
• Been publicly criticised by the US Government for illegally closing all border crossings into Palestine, making it harder than ever for Palestinians to access food, medicine or water

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog ... d-in-rafah

Gazans need to rise up and kill the HAMAS leadership. HAMAS is responsible for this disaster.

[bigtoughralf]

If you think the Israeli government has no responsibility for any of its own actions in Gaza then presumably you think the Chinese government has no responsibility for its actions in Xinjiang either?

[bigtoughralf]

Mourners gathered today to pay their respects to a family killed in an Israeli airstrike on a refugee camp.

Selah Rouqa's entire living family - 13 including her daughter, son in law, grandchildren and her son in law's relatives - were killed when the IDF attacked their home as they slept:

http://www.rte.ie/news/middle-east/2024 ... gaza-camp/

More than 36,000 Palestinians have been killed by Israel during its ongoing invasion of Gaza.

[Pack Rat]

The jews are still wondering if their family members who were taken as hostages are still alive.

[HitRed]

More than 36,000 Palestinians have been killed because of Hamas. Free elections now.

[Votanic]

This continual and seemingly unending blame-casting, finger-pointing, and non-stop villain/victim/virtue signalling only shows that this is a long way from over.
More death must/will be generated.
And the long-awaited end will only come into sight when those deaths are full and proper, thermonuclear deaths.

[bigtoughralf]

Both Hamas and the Israeli government appear to have shown support for a ceasefire deal that would include the IDF withdrawing from Gaza's residential areas, Hamas and Israel exchanging hostages, and Israel finally allowing some basic humanitarian aid to reach Gaza's starving population:

http://www.rte.ie/news/world/2024/0601/ ... -positive/

Will the ceasefire be enacted or will Israel continue its genocide?

[Dukasaur]

Both Hamas and the Israeli government appear to have shown support for a ceasefire deal that would include the IDF withdrawing from Gaza's residential areas, Hamas and Israel exchanging hostages, and Israel finally allowing some basic humanitarian aid to reach Gaza's starving population:

http://www.rte.ie/news/world/2024/0601/ ... -positive/

Will the ceasefire be enacted or will Israel continue its genocide?

Pressure is building, so I'm sure there will be a ceasefire.

And Hamas will be allowed to retreat and rebuild, and five years from now launch another murderous rampage. And the cycle will repeat.

[DirtyDishSoap]

Is this some bad Joker reference?

[Votanic]

Both Hamas and the Israeli government appear to have shown support for a ceasefire deal that would include the IDF withdrawing from Gaza's residential areas, Hamas and Israel exchanging hostages, and Israel finally allowing some basic humanitarian aid to reach Gaza's starving population:

http://www.rte.ie/news/world/2024/0601/ ... -positive/

Will the ceasefire be enacted or will Israel continue its genocide?

Pressure is building, so I'm sure there will be a ceasefire.

And Hamas will be allowed to retreat and rebuild, and five years from now launch another murderous rampage. And the cycle will repeat.

Wait. Who is going to "launch another murderous rampage".

Frankly, these baldly partisan statements are a pointless waste of text.
But yeah, a repeating cycle is much like a game-round, so then Hamas would likely play next, since Israel just played last.

[HitRed]

The Commandant’s Shadow

This is in limited release in the USA. About the son of the Auschwitz commander Rudolf Höss and a Jewish girl and her cello.

[bigtoughralf]

Both Hamas and the Israeli government appear to have shown support for a ceasefire deal that would include the IDF withdrawing from Gaza's residential areas, Hamas and Israel exchanging hostages, and Israel finally allowing some basic humanitarian aid to reach Gaza's starving population:

http://www.rte.ie/news/world/2024/0601/ ... -positive/

Will the ceasefire be enacted or will Israel continue its genocide?

Pressure is building, so I'm sure there will be a ceasefire.

And Hamas will be allowed to retreat and rebuild, and five years from now launch another murderous rampage. And the cycle will repeat.

There's a vague chance that Israel might end its occupations of Gaza and Palestine and stop allowing its military and settlers to brutalise Palestinian civilians over those five years though, so maybe the cycle could be broken.