End Time Prophesy (Are we living it?)

[joecoolfrog]

Player makes a very good point about the dangers of homeschooling and the subjugation of
science in favour of dogma, in years to come the US may pay a price for the peddling of ignorance. Future prosperity depends on engineers and scientists not demon slayers, the safety of the planet depends on rational decision making not messianic zeal.

ROFL! You know, I'd never have thought to see the day when a "Christian" sides with the world. This is just toooooo insane to take seriously. Player PLEASE don't have children.

Why is it insane to warn against kids being brainwashed and denied a broad education ?
Why is it insane for a Christian to wish to be part of the modern world and not stuck in a quagmire of ignorance , not everybody is so shallow that they need to live in a darkened room to shield their faith from the beacon of Knowledge.Millions of people from all religions reconcile their beliefs with progressive thought, only the emotionaly crippled need to seek solace in the discredited and absurd myths of a less enlightened age,

Simply put. Christians are called "to be in the world, not of the world". That being said, any Christian can see how bias public education is. From teaching evolution as "the only possible explanation" to "we can't expect our kids to abstain so lets hand out contraception 'just in case' ". For a "Christian" to put down homeschooling where God has a chance to actually influence their children's life in favor of a godless, amoral, "tolerant" education system is OUT OF THIS WORLD! Dare I say "unChristian"?

There is no competing scientific theory to evolution,if one is found it will be taught I imagine. Contraceptives are not handed out regularly at school and even if they were then A) Nobody need take them and B) Nobody need use them though if they want to have sex its a good idea dont you think. Lastly if God wants to influence a child then nothing could stop him could it, what you mean is you want the children brainwashed by their parents WITHOUT any outside influence getting in the way. You can believe what you like but its disgusting that you think that Kids should be forced to follow a path that has been chosen for them,they have a right to decide for themselves. Lastly the idea that having faith in another life precludes belonging fully to this one is ridiculous,as I said before that is the mindset of martyrs and inspires suicide bombers.

[Hologram]

I just pity all the shielded kids who get out in the world and realize how great sin is because they've never had to deal with it because they're parents are scared that the big bad world will get them and the kids will end up impregnating 20 women.

Tsk tsk.

[Jenos Ridan]

Why is it insane to warn against kids being brainwashed and denied a broad education ?
Why is it insane for a Christian to wish to be part of the modern world and not stuck in a quagmire of ignorance , not everybody is so shallow that they need to live in a darkened room to shield their faith from the beacon of Knowledge.Millions of people from all religions reconcile their beliefs with progressive thought, only the emotionaly crippled need to seek solace in the discredited and absurd myths of a less enlightened age,

Wow. Quite profound Senor Frog. Knowing two home-school families, I agree 100%. Among other things, I feel very sorry for their socially stunted children. These kids are going to have a very hard time at college...if they go at all. I fully expect them to go into full rebellion mode at about 17...their parents will look at each other in complete confusion...and then quickly point the finger at anything other than themselves.

I call this one out: I know four people from one home-schooled family, none of them are "socially-stunted". The oldest is married and attained at least a four-year degree in chemistry, the second oldest has a two-year in welding technology and works in Portland. The third is a music instructor and , lkast I heard, part-time college student. The youngest is just like anyother 16 year old I've ment.

The notion that home-schooling results in ignorance is bunk; it doesn't take much to insure that people can be educated at home. I'm a product of Public Schooling and I have seen, and see now, no negative impact of home-schooling. In fact, I think they had a better education than I did. Why? Because Public Educators operate as factory hands, processing students in an assembly line manner. There is no incentive in many schools to actually bring out the best in the individual student, just drone on with the same ciriculum year after year.

This was my experience here in the US, I hold no illusions that this is the status quo for all the rest of the schools around the world. I actually would wish the US would set up it's schools more like Germany, with the kids that are college material going one way and the rest going on their own paths. So long as parents are allowed to have the option (emphasis on optional), I'll be estatic with any positive changes, like dumping all that stupid standardized testing; it's killing the actual skill set these kids actually need and use. Also, it doesn't directly effect their grades but they cannot pass if they don't pass the WASL? What a load of crap!

Someone, please, tell me I'm not alone in noticing how backwards this all is! I'm wiggin' out over here!

[Simon Viavant]

Evolution is supported because it is scientifically sound, has been proved to a certain degree, and the alternative... I'm not even gonna go there. I'm in high school and I have some home school friends. They're very social, but their education is a bit lacking. They went to public school up until 7nth grade though. Anyone I know who's been home schooled their whole life are clueless, socially.

[Juan_Bottom]

I just pity all the shielded kids who get out in the world and realize how great sin is because they've never had to deal with it because they're parents are scared that the big bad world will get them and the kids will end up impregnating 20 women.

Tsk tsk.

Or if they're raised right, the same woman 20 times.

[Jenos Ridan]

I just pity all the shielded kids who get out in the world and realize how great sin is because they've never had to deal with it because they're parents are scared that the big bad world will get them and the kids will end up impregnating 20 women.

Tsk tsk.

Or if they're raised right, the same woman 20 times.

If we assume that there were "raised right", then we can assume that they will pass these traits of "proper upbringing" to the next generation and so on.

The issue is then to determine what the traits are of a proper upbringing. If it includes courtesy to ones fellows, I see no harm. If it also includes a strong work ethic, all the better. And so on.

Therefore, done right, it is a very good thing, something to be encouraged; an increased number of upstanding, moral citizen cannot possible be a bad thing. In fact, it is desperately needed.

[heavycola]

Why is it insane to warn against kids being brainwashed and denied a broad education ?
Why is it insane for a Christian to wish to be part of the modern world and not stuck in a quagmire of ignorance , not everybody is so shallow that they need to live in a darkened room to shield their faith from the beacon of Knowledge.Millions of people from all religions reconcile their beliefs with progressive thought, only the emotionaly crippled need to seek solace in the discredited and absurd myths of a less enlightened age,

Wow. Quite profound Senor Frog. Knowing two home-school families, I agree 100%. Among other things, I feel very sorry for their socially stunted children. These kids are going to have a very hard time at college...if they go at all. I fully expect them to go into full rebellion mode at about 17...their parents will look at each other in complete confusion...and then quickly point the finger at anything other than themselves.

I call this one out: I know four people from one home-schooled family, none of them are "socially-stunted". The oldest is married and attained at least a four-year degree in chemistry, the second oldest has a two-year in welding technology and works in Portland. The third is a music instructor and , lkast I heard, part-time college student. The youngest is just like anyother 16 year old I've ment.

The notion that home-schooling results in ignorance is bunk; it doesn't take much to insure that people can be educated at home. I'm a product of Public Schooling and I have seen, and see now, no negative impact of home-schooling. In fact, I think they had a better education than I did. Why? Because Public Educators operate as factory hands, processing students in an assembly line manner. There is no incentive in many schools to actually bring out the best in the individual student, just drone on with the same ciriculum year after year.

So.. you know one well-taught home-schooled family.
Look, home schooling of itself is not a bad thing. BUt here we are talking about the fundamentalist evangelical movement to take their kids out of school - where they are taught by trained, specialist, full-time educators - and into their homes, where they are taught by parents - usually home-makin' moms - who don't know what they are doing, only that their children are learning stuff they don't understand in school.

The documerntary Jesus Camp showed a couple of these families - the kids are sat in front of a TV showing creationist 'educational' programmes, where two guys in safari suits use an appeal to incredulity over and over again to suggest evolution can't be true. It is either disgusting sophistry or plain stupidity. But those kids are being brainwashed.
Our education systems are supposed to teach kids to think for themselves - any science or RE teacher worth their salt would welcome a debate on creation myths vs evolution. These kids are being programmed to become close-minded extremists, nothing less.

[Juan_Bottom]

Good point HEAVYCOLA!!!!!!! JESUS CAMP was seriously a scary film. HARRY POTTER IS GOING TO HELL!!!!!!!! THOSE KIDS THAT READ HIS BOOKS, ARE GOING TO HELL!!!!!!!

Anyway though, I just think JENOS missed what was originally being discussed, because this thread is full of crap.

[Backglass]

So.. you know one well-taught home-schooled family.

And I know two! I win!

But seriously...there are good and bad home schoolers and good & bad public schools. The difference is that the public schools have oversite. Homeschooler's are left to their own devices. The woman I know who homeschool's her kids (and won't vaccinate them either...a WHOLE other thread!) will often just say "OK...Today is a library day" when she doesn't feel like "teaching". So the kids just sit and read a book...all day long. I get the feeling this happens more often than not. Teaching is a full time job...not some experimental hobby with your kids as lab rats.

The documerntary Jesus Camp showed a couple of these families...These kids are being programmed to become close-minded extremists, nothing less.

Totally agree. As are evangelical christian kids all over the nation. They never had a chance to decide, the brainwashing starts at birth. Conversely I have been accused on this board of "teaching my kids atheism" which in itself is impossible. Teach your kids about nothing? How does that work exactly?

[diddle]

This thread makes good reading. But unfortunately I'd finished on the toilet by page 4....

You read threads in an internet forum on the toilet?

You gotta love wireless....

Also gives me the chance to have a wump.

[jay_a2j]

The woman I know who homeschool's her kids (and won't vaccinate them either...a WHOLE other thread!) will often just say "OK...Today is a library day" when she doesn't feel like "teaching". So the kids just sit and read a book...all day long. I get the feeling this happens more often than not. Teaching is a full time job...not some experimental hobby with your kids as lab rats.

I remember in 10th or 11th grade US History, I had a teacher that should not have been teaching. The entire time I had him, the only time he EVER stood in front of the class and "taught" was the one day we had a school official sitting in the back of the class watching! Everyday was the same routeen, get our packet of fill-in worksheets and fill them in. Not hard at all since the worksheets were word for word out of the textbook. When a chapter was finished we took a test on it. Then received the next packet, on the next chapter. This went on and on, we hardly heard his voice. I remember one time while taking a test, I didn't know the answer to a question so I put down "Mary had a little lamb" to see if he would mark it wrong. (because I was having doubts that he even graded our exams) I got the test back with that question CORRECT! Thus proving that this guy was a giant waste of space. I have other horror stories from my public education background, as well.

[ParadiceCity9]

The woman I know who homeschool's her kids (and won't vaccinate them either...a WHOLE other thread!) will often just say "OK...Today is a library day" when she doesn't feel like "teaching". So the kids just sit and read a book...all day long. I get the feeling this happens more often than not. Teaching is a full time job...not some experimental hobby with your kids as lab rats.

I remember in 10th or 11th grade US History, I had a teacher that should not have been teaching. The entire time I had him, the only time he EVER stood in front of the class and "taught" was the one day we had a school official sitting in the back of the class watching! Everyday was the same routeen, get our packet of fill-in worksheets and fill them in. Not hard at all since the worksheets were word for word out of the textbook. When a chapter was finished we took a test on it. Then received the next packet, on the next chapter. This went on and on, we hardly heard his voice. I remember one time while taking a test, I didn't know the answer to a question so I put down "Mary had a little lamb" to see if he would mark it wrong. (because I was having doubts that he even graded our exams) I got the test back with that question CORRECT! Thus proving that this guy was a giant waste of space. I have other horror stories from my public education background, as well.

That is very poor evidence that every public school system is flawed. All but one of my 13 high school teachers so far have been quality, where I enjoyed and got a lot out of their classes. The one, ironically, was my 10th grade english teacher. All we did, almost literally, was read. Honestly, it was the pointless class I'd ever taken, and ever will take. But engilsh class doesn't matter, except for learning how to write well for college and learning vocabulary. Oh and btw, the things we read were fiction, then we answered questions on them.

[Backglass]

I remember in 10th or 11th grade US History, I had a teacher that should not have been teaching. The entire time I had him, the only time he EVER stood in front of the class and "taught" was the one day we had a school official sitting in the back of the class watching! Everyday was the same routeen, get our packet of fill-in worksheets and fill them in. Not hard at all since the worksheets were word for word out of the textbook. When a chapter was finished we took a test on it. Then received the next packet, on the next chapter. This went on and on, we hardly heard his voice. I remember one time while taking a test, I didn't know the answer to a question so I put down "Mary had a little lamb" to see if he would mark it wrong. (because I was having doubts that he even graded our exams) I got the test back with that question CORRECT! Thus proving that this guy was a giant waste of space. I have other horror stories from my public education background, as well.

Yes jay...you had a crappy teacher for ONE subject. for ONE year.

Home schooled kids have that crappy teacher EVERY DAY, for EVERY SUBJECT for 13 YEARS.

How are your kids coming along at home? Hmmm? How many lesson plans did you write today in between cigarette breaks?

[tzor]

Yes jay...you had a crappy teacher for ONE subject. for ONE year.

I think most of us probably had one crappy teacher for one subject for one year. Mine was in the 6th grade. We had just gotten this new principal, along with his "famous" credentials, ready to bring our elementary school into the modern age. So in the 6th grade I was given this "plan." I would have to make out the plan every week. If I made it, "fine." If I didn't make it, also "fine." (Smart people could see the problem right there.) Needless to say I wasn't doing well. My father purchased these special rote learning records of the multiplication tables. The teacher seemed very impressed until the parent teacher night where my father explained why I was doing well and how it had nothing whatsoever to do with her. As he often said, "I wouldn't trust her as a babysitter much less a teacher."

But don't be too hard on home schooled people. Some parents actually do put in the time and the effort. The advantages of having a class size of one or three as opposed to twelve or twenty can be impressive assuming you have a person who is willing to take the time and has the resources available to do the task.

[Backglass]

Some parents actually do put in the time and the effort.

I am sure there are some that do. I am also sure that this is the exception, not the rule.

[apey]

Wasn't that the one given a 1 in 5,050 chance of hitting Earth?

(not arguing for or against anything)

From what I hear it will not hit the Earth but pass close enough to cause a pole shift, possibly violent earthquakes and such. It would be catastrophic to life on Earth.

Sure, universally speaking, 1 in 5,050 is a hit....... I can see catastrophies. Hope NASA has their "asteroid blaster" up by then .

Can't blast an asteroid because then instead of one big hit we would have hundreds (or more) little hits that would be far more devastating! Don't you guys ever watch national geographic or discovery or even history channel ?

[Juan_Bottom]

Yes jay...you had a crappy teacher for ONE subject. for ONE year.

Mr. Viesel, for three years(our tiny schools only science teacher), failed me for not being Christian. Had to take correspondance courses to pass High School because he was our only science teacher. Sorry I don't believe in creationism.
Mrs. Hull for four years(our tiny schools computer teacher), never tought the class anything. I don't even remember what her voice sounds like. Instead, she let computer programs "teach us." Then our final came from another book that had nothing to do with those progrrams. Seriously, I still can't type without looking.....
Mrs. Rude, Who promised me that if I came in everyday before school and studied with her as my tutor that I couldn't fail my math class. I came in every morning for months, and failed with a 58%. Lesson was, never try.
Mr. Downs, who tought U.S. Wars by having us watch "war films" like Pearl Harbor! For our final we had to write a report on one of these films, and make a model of something "war related." I picked Catapult, and got an A!!!! A Catapult for U.S. Wars; It was my own inside joke.
Mrs. Volwinkle, not kidding, probably the one of the worst human beings that I have ever met. I could have tought her class. I did my cousins homework for her, but our grades were opposite(A++,D-). I never found out why she hated me so much. I never mis-behaved in that class, or anything. And seriously, I did do my cousin's homework, and she did have the highest grade in that class.
Mrs. Wilson, Every year before school starts the BE has to sort out the kids whos parents have come to the school to make sure that their kids won't have her.
And Mrs. What's-her-face, whos name I can't place right now. She got busted for spitting on students in 6th grade.

These are all teachers that I had. All but the last two were high school teachers.

I am pro-home schooling. Provided that the kids are getting an education in Science, and English, and Mathmatics, and not the Bible as a substitute for these things. But that's what we all agree, right?

Can't blast an asteroid because then instead of one big hit we would have hundreds (or more) little hits that would be far more devastating! Don't you guys ever watch national geographic or discovery or even history channel ?

No, not that kind of "blaster," lol! It's a floating space station/satallite that will attach to the side of a dangerous asteroid and blast it away from us with rockets!

[Cypress333]

Backglass:

Huh? Convert to what exactly? Is this what Mommy, Daddy or the Preacher Man told you?

Atheism is not a religion. It is simply a description like "Blonde" or "SKinny". It simply means you don't believe in gods...any of them. Thats all. Nothing more.

No "conversions", no church, no bibles, no gods, no demons, no magical miracles, no rituals, we don't "fellowship" or even get together usually...that would be too much like a religion. Oh...and we sleep in on Sunday mornings.

Actually, I don't believe you can classify you are an atheist, because as I said earlier, atheist try to disprove religion, while non-believers simply don't care. So, if you are trying to disprove, you are atheist, if not, you are a simple non-believer.

But don't worry, I'll pray for you.

[kagetora]

Good luck with your .01% success rate.

[Juan_Bottom]

Good luck with your .01% success rate.

[Cypress333]

Well, think about it, there are 2.2 billion christians on the world, an estimated 1.8 billion pray daily, .7 billion pray twice a day, .3 billion pray three times daily, .2 billion pray at least four times a day. So on a typical day a .01 % rate means that 42 MILLION prayers are answered daily, I THINK THAT'S PRETTY GOOD ODDS.

And that's not even on a Sunday.

[suggs]

Are we talking about education? I can t be bothered to read most of this self indulgent garbage.
If we are, the answer: raise taxes, pay teachers approx 50,000 pounds a year (100,000 dollars?) then you'll attract the best people to teach, instead of them wasting their lives in the finance markets.
But people don't like paying for a better society, so its never gonna happen.
Next.

[Cypress333]

Suggs, i think you're in the wrong forum dude.

[MeDeFe]

Well, think about it, there are 2.2 billion christians on the world, an estimated 1.8 billion pray daily, .7 billion pray twice a day, .3 billion pray three times daily, .2 billion pray at least four times a day. So on a typical day a .01 % rate means that 42 MILLION prayers are answered daily, I THINK THAT'S PRETTY GOOD ODDS.

And that's not even on a Sunday.

And what did they ask for? That nothing particularly bad should happen to them that day again?

[suggs]

Suggs, i think you're in the wrong forum dude.

more than likely
I can't find the "BIG THROBBING COCKS" thread either