Is January 7th the Real Christmas?

[CreepersWiener]

It seems that Russians celebrate Christmas on the 7th of January. The 6th of January is the Twelfth Day of Christmas, as at one time January 6th was considered to be the actual day of Christ's birth until Emperor Constantine moved it to December the 25th closer to the pagan solstice celebrations (later declared official by Pope Julius 1). Also, I had heard that Christians in the early church celebrated Christmas on the 26th instead of the 25th, so that might have something to do with why the Russians celebrate Christmas on the 7th instead of January 6th. I found it interesting that what Americans and other Westerners consider Christmas celebrations (partying, gifts, Santa, etc.) is observed at New Year's and then Christmas is reserved as a more religious, spiritual holiday.

Doesn't it seem strange how America seemed to be the "Christian Nation" and the Russians were the evil atheists? Now it seems the tables have turned. Decades of disallowing the Russian people to worship God has seemed to have made them more pious then the West.

If the Word of the Bible is correct, that could only mean that God would deliver the United States into the hands of the Russians.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bp1YXPNQ ... re=channel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9iSXElP0454

[Night Strike]

I didn't know celebrating Christmas on a different day made one group more pious than another. It ultimately doesn't matter which day it's celebrated on as long as people know the reason why it's celebrated.

[Army of GOD]

I didn't know celebrating Christmas on a different day made one group more pious than another. It ultimately doesn't matter which day it's celebrated on as long as people know the reason why it's celebrated.

To celebrate the defeat of Napoleon's army in Waterloo?

[tzor]

The simple answer is NO. The more complex answer: Russian Orthodoxy comes from Greek Orthodoxy: Both use the Julian calendar. Jan 7th in the Gregorian Calendar is Dec 25th in the Julian Calendar.

Now here is where things get interesting. Jan 6th, the Feast of the Epiphany was an older feast than that of the Feast of the Mass of Christ (Christmass).

The earliest reference to Epiphany as a Christian feast was in A.D. 361, by Ammianus Marcellinus St. Epiphanius says that January 6 is hemera genethlion toutestin epiphanion (Christ's "Birthday; that is, His Epiphany"). He also asserts that the Miracle at Cana occurred on the same calendar day.

The reasons and the exact years when Rome started celebrating the birth of Jesus on the "eighth before the calends of January " is not entirely clear as this has always been a minor feast in the Church (the primary feast of the Church being Easter).

[Serbia]

I've actually heard it debated that Christ was actually born in the springtime, and not in winter at all.

Bottom line is, no one can say with any certainty either way.

[CreepersWiener]

I've actually heard it debated that Christ was actually born in the springtime, and not in winter at all.

Bottom line is, no one can say with any certainty either way.

What I have dug up off the interwebz, is that Christ would have been born between spring and the fall of the year. I heard around September or October to be the closer time frame of Jesus' birth. The other part, is that January 6th is considered Jesus' real birthday as that some Christians held that that day was the official baptism of Jesus, which would be the beginning of his ministry. Therefore, Jesus' true spiritual birthday. Anyway, doesn't really matter I guess. Just interesting to talk about.

[Pedronicus]

Apart from the worlds best selling fiction book, where are the real facts that Jesus actually ever existed?

[CreepersWiener]

Apart from the worlds best selling fiction book, where are the real facts that Jesus actually ever existed?

I heard that Mary's cherry is locked up at the Vatican...

[tzor]

Apart from the worlds best selling fiction book, where are the real facts that Jesus actually ever existed?

Why do you look for facts? Are you interested in becoming one of his disciples?

Seriously, what facts are you looking for? There are no news reporters in the Roman Empire. Historians of the Roman Empire generally only write about important people and the only important people live in Rome. Jerusalem is a backwater hick territory that was given a blanket exception to the general requirement that people in the empire should worship the Roman gods (in short they were a bunch of athiests) who were stubborn, obnoxious, and rebellious.

Apart from the writings of those (initially Jews and later non Jews which started to stretch the Jewish exception to the limits) who followed him the only references come from a disgruntled Jewish historian who was in general more angry at the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans. That was many decades after his supposed death.

Anything the Gnostics (cool look a good fad we can mimic) wrote was pure fan fiction.

If he had not existed it would be highly doubtful people (who should have been in the know) would have died for their beliefs. That doesn't mean he was what they said he was, but clearly it is easier to support someone who you think you know than someone who you just invented out of thin air.

[jay_a2j]

The reason Mary and Joseph went to Bethlehem was because of the census that was taking place. So, all you'd have to do to find a likely time frame for the birth of Christ is find out when that census took place in 0 AD. (Some speculate that it was in September)

[Titanic]

The reason Mary and Joseph went to Bethlehem was because of the census that was taking place. So, all you'd have to do to find a likely time frame for the birth of Christ is find out when that census took place in 0 AD. (Some speculate that it was in September)

Indeed, the december date was chosen in the dark ages because the its clashed with pagan festivals which the christian leaders of the time found very convenient.