Civilization Mafia - Town Victory!

[Samlen]

What advantage would dakky get from killing his only ally Tim?

Unexpectedness. Otherwise, it made absolutely no sense to kill Tim, especially given the speed hammering he did yesterday would've put him in a very suspicious light today.

[dakky21]

You gave practically no reason and it feels like you are just jumping on someone to lynch...

Yes and I'm contributing to my lynch and I'm even thinking of not going to war this time so real townies can see who went after me.

[Fircoal]

Cut down the post a bit but in response to your rebuttal, the first point is completely mute. My theory hinged upon the idea that scum had been given fake claims and I don't think that is the stupidest idea presented out there. It would be inherently sensible to give scum a hand particularly if they were unaware at first instance of the buildings concepts which appears to be the case.m

The supporting evidence to the fake claim theory being that the only counterclaim we had was your one, where hotshot made a really strange post as a claim at a point when regardless of his claim he was getting hanged. It is possible that all scum had fake claims, some weaker than others, maybe benga had the celts, you had the Mongols and hotshot had the Aztecs. It was decided the Aztecs was the strongest claim and the plan set in motion could be there is a 4th Mafia member like Dakky who had the Japanese.

Agree celts is a pretty weak claim but maybe Masket is a fan of the Celts seeing as they are Brits idk . Weren't they in civ II?

Uh but they all had claims why not make a strong one and then claim back with the same strong one. There's no reason for hotshot to make his claim weaker if that was the plan. I see no reason to believe that the scum had fake claims considering what they did claim.

Quick post as I won't be able to do a proper one until sunday but had many epiphanies:

The watcher is a powerful power.

I don't see watcher as an end all be all because it's way easier to pick someone you're suspicious of and track them to a NK than trying to pick somone you think will be NKed and hope only one person visits it. It is slightly more useful in this game because we need to be able to verify claim actions but it still can be pretty useless. For instance, I think picking Ragian to watch is a weird choice. And, as stated by Nag, if you only plan to use that one power to always claim your action last it becomes pretty scummy. But come to think of it, the dead scum weren't vanilla so only using only one power and stating the truth would be an interesting way for scum to get around the action massclaiming also.

Personally I find watchers just as useful as trackers. You still get to find information. I think it's just as hard to pick as who got NK'd than who is the mafia. And in games with only one scummy doing the kill it's even harder to track that one guy, so I'd put them on the same level.

I wonder why I picked Ragian. Why did you block Tim? Why did Samlen investigate Tim? It's the exact same reason. I thought Tim was suspicious so I watched who he was planned to visit.

That is a fair point. If my building builds at the end of the day (Which is when Masket said it would be finished.) then I will use that buildings power. Otherwise I am stuck with just a lighthouse. (If you're wondering why I am only stuck with a lighthouse after all these nights it's because I forgot to build something Night 3. I actually barely got in my build for Night 2 because I ended up reading the pm wrong the first time. @.@)

[Samlen]

You gave practically no reason and it feels like you are just jumping on someone to lynch...

Yes and I'm contributing to my lynch and I'm even thinking of not going to war this time so real townies can see who went after me.

You're voting me to purposefully look suspicious and get lynched off? Am I reading that correctly? Because that is extremely unhelpful. Suiciding is generally considered bad form, unless it's built into your role...

[ga7]

What advantage would dakky get from killing his only ally Tim?

Hrm, killing Tim makes no sense to me for anyone but it's true it makes even less sense for dakky. It could just be picking whoever was least likely to be watched though?
I dunno, the more this day goes on the more I feel like grasping at straws, but I could completely see a barbarian immune to war effects using war like that.

[Ragian]

It's Samlen, dakky, or me, it seems. So could people at least vote or something?

[Skittles!]

I'm going to vote samlen. out of the three that are being voted on, he seems the most likely candidate for scum in my eyes. Dakky is a close second. His burst in activity after being called out and only giving info after being asked his opinion rather than providing it beforehand, and his hesitancy to see hotshot's scumness when it was obvious, is sticking out to me.

[Skittles!]

I'm going to vote samlen. out of the three that are being voted on, he seems the most likely candidate for scum in my eyes. Dakky is a close second. His burst in activity after being called out and only giving info after being asked his opinion rather than providing it beforehand, and his hesitancy to see hotshot's scumness when it was obvious, is sticking out to me.

Also he really seemed to be clutching at straws with his long accusatory post. To even entertain the idea that Mitch and I are working together as scum is one of the most bizarre things I have read this game.

[Samlen]

It was simply me covering all possibilities (and I mentioned it was highly unlikely... it's a little weird that you jumped on something that was so small) My main suspicion is still ragian. Also can you explain how my post is grasping at straws? I felt like I'd explained my thought process fairly logically but I"ll reiterate it here. Each person was either at war or had their action accounted for by another person except Ga, Nag, Ragian and me. I'm the Roman Empire, my investigation showed ga as inno, nag is clearly India which leaves Ragian as most suspicious. If I'm reading correctly I'm L-1. On the offchance that I survive I'd rather not goto war and delay my investigations but I'd love some friendship....

[Ragian]

unvote just for now.

Why? Why am I suspicious? Give us something solid. And Greece is one of the best civilisations with the best words. How can they stick out to you?

[Samlen]

Purely because of the actions last night. In trying to figure out who killed Tim it has to be someone who's action wasn't confirmed or at war. Maybe Ga is a godfather, or maybe barbarians can still use actions while at war or maybe two mafia memebers 'confirmed' each others actions but I have no idea if either of those are true so I'm assuming the simpler solution in that they aren't.

[Skittles!]

It was simply me covering all possibilities (and I mentioned it was highly unlikely... it's a little weird that you jumped on something that was so small) My main suspicion is still ragian. Also can you explain how my post is grasping at straws? I felt like I'd explained my thought process fairly logically but I"ll reiterate it here. Each person was either at war or had their action accounted for by another person except Ga, Nag, Ragian and me. I'm the Roman Empire, my investigation showed ga as inno, nag is clearly India which leaves Ragian as most suspicious. If I'm reading correctly I'm L-1. On the offchance that I survive I'd rather not goto war and delay my investigations but I'd love some friendship....

I know you said it was super unlikely but I found it strange that you suggested it at all. Now that I think about it, N2 saw both hotshot and ga7 blocked from doing anything, and there were no kills. Hotshot was lynched, and kills continued. You suggest ga7 is a godfather but still go after Ragian. Do you think ga7 and Ragian are the two scum left? Or do you think it's more likely to be ga7 and nag?

unvote, vote ga7. I know I've been jumping all over the place this day with my votes, and that itself is scummy and suss, but really it's because I just get ideas and just try to see where they go.

If ga7 isn't lynched then I will still be blocking him tonight to test my theory. If he is godfather, as Sam is suggesting, then there won't be any other kills.

[Samlen]

I mentioned it only because it helps me think when I type down all of the possibilities and I hope it helps others think outside the box. I suppose I'm mostly just hoping that my one usable investigation is actually correct... It's pretty apparent that noone else thinks ragian is evil so I'll investigate him or dakky tonight. The next question is whether a godfather or war not affecting barbarians is more likely and I really don't know

[Minister Masket]

Vote Count

dakky21 - 1 (ga7)
madmitch - 0
ga7 - 1 (skittles)
strike wolf - 0
Samlen - 2 (dakky, madmitch)
Ragian - 1 (Samlen)
nagerous - 0
Fircoal - 0
Skittles - 0

Allowing for a full day, Day 5 effectively started on Monday, so on today (Sat) it takes 4 to Lynch!

[Skittles!]

I mentioned it only because it helps me think when I type down all of the possibilities and I hope it helps others think outside the box. I suppose I'm mostly just hoping that my one usable investigation is actually correct... It's pretty apparent that noone else thinks ragian is evil so I'll investigate him or dakky tonight. The next question is whether a godfather or war not affecting barbarians is more likely and I really don't know

Well, sure. But going off the chart -

Then on N2 there were two people blocked: Hotshot, Ga7. No one died. Now, we know that Hotshot was scum, but he wasn't godfather. Ga7 is still around, and there have been deaths every night since. I don't know how I didn't pick this up before, but it really leaves only one player left to do the kills (and possibly another barbarian, but nag is sure there's only 1 left). Even if no one agrees with me about ga7, I'm still blocking him tonight. He says he 'blocked' Tim last night but Tim ended up dying, and Fircoal saw Tim visit Ragian. There is an inconsistency that even ga7 pointed out. Yes, MM did somewhat explain how he does things, but nonetheless I think this is something that town can work with. Godfather also always comes up as town when investigated, and there must be a reason why Samlen investigated him in the first place.

[Samlen]

Typically speaking, the godather just finalizes the mafia kill; they do not have to be the one carrying out the kill, meaning it could have easily have been hotshot that carried out the kill but was blocked. We weren't specifically told what Hotshot's role of being a terrorist meant, but research would lead me to believe he was a day activated suicide bomber, leaving him open to taking the kill. Could've just as easily been ga though so who knows. I don't even remember my reasoning for investigating ga.. my best guess was random to avoid the chance that my investigation target died.

[nagerous]

Sorry I have been snowed this weekend but would anyone who has some time be willing to check for the names of each building and who said that building's name first in the thread? Search button will be your friend with this.

[Samlen]

Building - Samlen day 1 page 6
Bunker - Ga7 day 3 page 20
Arsenal - Samlen day 1 page 14 (Minister had used the word 'arsenal' twice before this but not in a way to implicate that it was a building)
Brothel - Skittles day 3 page 19
Lighthouse - Madmitch day 5 page 29
Hunting Lodge - Timwoodbury day 3 page 19
No mention of 'spy' but 'spies' were mentioned by me on day 5 page 27 and 'spy network' by Nag on day 5 page 28
Hospital - Skittles day 3 page 20

If search function has not failed me I'm going to discard the notion that Ga might be a godfather and going back to the assumption that, based off of last night's actions, Ragian is still the most likely candidate for being evil.

[Samlen]

Also again in favor of not being lynch because Dakky and Mitch won't move their votes and most people aren't voting, I'll formally ask for friendship from everyone except Dakky and Ragian.

[Fircoal]

I accept friendship with Samlen

The more I think about it the more I'm not sure if Sam is bad. And to boot he has a spy network. If he's good he currently has the best chance at giving us info. I don't think we should protect him forever but I do think he should live one more night to see what he has to get from it. He's probably going to be the most useful at night.

[dakky21]

So me, Sam, ga7 and Rage are on one vote. Four ties (because of Samlen's friendship). Tomorrow, Monday, it will be 2 to lynch and that will happen in about 3-4 hours.

Well, you leave me no choice other than go to war again to remove possibility of getting speed lynched like DJ was lynched...

Declare WAR on Nagerous

That leaves Samlen, ga7 and rage on L-1 tomorrow which will be soon.

[strike wolf]

[Fircoal]

So me, Sam, ga7 and Rage are on one vote. Four ties (because of Samlen's friendship). Tomorrow, Monday, it will be 2 to lynch and that will happen in about 3-4 hours.

Well, you leave me no choice other than go to war again to remove possibility of getting speed lynched like DJ was lynched...

Declare WAR on Nagerous

That leaves Samlen, ga7 and rage on L-1 tomorrow which will be soon.

Vote: Dakky

I don't know if you're scum or not but if you're going to keep on pulling this every day it's going to hurt the town.

Yes no town member wants themselves to be lynched, but if you drag other town members into war you're hurting the amount of information that can be gathered. Which is BAD. And you clearly seem more concerned keeping yourself alive rather than finding out scum.

[Skittles!]

So me, Sam, ga7 and Rage are on one vote. Four ties (because of Samlen's friendship). Tomorrow, Monday, it will be 2 to lynch and that will happen in about 3-4 hours.

Well, you leave me no choice other than go to war again to remove possibility of getting speed lynched like DJ was lynched...

Declare WAR on Nagerous

That leaves Samlen, ga7 and rage on L-1 tomorrow which will be soon.

Why don't you declare war on someone you think is actually scum so they (hopefully) cannot do their night action? Rather than just declaring war on other town members? I have to agree with Fircoal, you are not helping us if you are just declaring war every day and not overly contributing to the success of town.
In this instance you really leave me no chance but to unvote, vote Dakky.

I am still roleblocking ga7 tonight but dakky's actions cannot continue unless he wants to contribute in other ways.

[dakky21]

I thought Samlen or ga7 are scum but going into war with them only gives them +3 votes for lynch so I decided to go against someone who is not at L-1. That way I get 3 votes surplus and they don't get anything. Yeah. Bad for town, but also bad for them.... think it that way...