[10-Jul-2006] Terminator games

[PaperPlunger]

uber sick new gameplay stuff!!!!

terminator will be crazy, it's gonna be 6 people, none with continents, and one army over their country count

[nascarfan38124]

Also, when playing sequential team games many find it unfair that the first team gets a lot of firepower while their opponents have their hands tied. The order is now staggered to alternate between teams. I know some people find it fun to be able to coordinate a double or triple play with your team - you can still pull that off in a freestyle game where it would be more appropriate.

So I guess from this that it aint true sequential then??
Hmmm dont know if i like that. even when Im not going first in a doubles I dont really mind. The only time you really lose out is in a 4 person doubles as the first team really can get into a strong position.

i actually think the new way is more of a sequential then the old, most team card games are played like that

[General Mayhem]

Actually scratch what i said earlier. I suppose it is 'true' sequential as its one opponent at a time when it is staggered

Bretsky and Philbert came up with a suggestion which I strongly agree with though.

The main issue for staggering the sequential games is that the first team to play can get a game winning foothold on territory from the first round.
Especially in those 4 player doubles/no cards/unlimited fortifications eh?!
(you boys at the top of the leader board no all about that one !!! )

If only the first one or two rounds are staggered then the initial land grab is neutralised while still allowing the strategic team element of planning the next group move.

I know this can still be done in freestyle games but i think the planning of team moves in succession is still very important to the sequential doubles/triples game.

Thoughts anyone?


<modo edit> one thought...keep the size normal...PLEASE!</modo edit>

[nascarfan38124]

I want to say that i think the new changes are awsome but i have to agree with Marvaddin one one point

Please, pleeeeease, you can increase the options, but dont change the rules and make them obrigatory simply because a few people can win using them, lack.

I think the new changes should be added as extra options but you shouldn't change the rules like that especially without a warning
you guys are doing a great job
Thanks alot

[wicked]

SWEEEET! I just noticed people on my ignore list were removed from old game chats. now the one-sided conversations are really funny...lol.

edit: actually they weren't removed entirely, if I take them off my ignore list, their "chat" comes back up.

[HighBorn]

now that i do have to say is kidda cool... still want my games i started back

[TheGeneral]

I saw this in the new Instructions pages about Chained fortifications.

Fortifications
With chained fortifications, you can reinforce once and from a country connected by countries you own.

With adjacent fortifications, you can reinforce once and only from a direct neighbour. This requires you to plan your deployment and advances more carefully.

With unlimited fortifications, you can reinforce as many times as you like from countries connected by countries you own. This makes the game easier and more flexible.

[nascarfan38124]

the terminator game sound great and i cant wait to play one but i have too many games right now so i cant and i made the games right before these new games came out

[johnnyrotten]

Team sequeential staggered order was suggested by thegrimsleeper, madeinchinain85, johnnyrotten, 2dimes, Enter Smith, bluesrock12000, agarvin, and kingwaffles.

You sure?

[rocksolid]

Applause for the new changes. I think staggering team games makes so much more sense, though I agree that having options to choose from (triples, staggered triples, doubles, staggered doubles, standard, terminator) always makes people happier. I can see the concern about making the "start your own game" page too confusing for new players, but I think if the presentation were a little heavier - more boxes and borders - it could work. The WaW start page is an example of going too far in the options direction, but you're very far from there yet.

One complication I foresee - when people sign up for doubles games, they often have a partner in mind to play alongside. Until now this was easy - you signed up right after each other and you'd know that you're partners. Does this still stand, or (as I suspect) do you have to coordinate signing up 1st and 4th or 2nd and 5th, etc? If so, I think this could mean a huge decrease in the number of doubles and triples games.

Great work! Terminator should be fun, once I see how it works. Thanks for all your efforts.

[lackattack]

There is something I forgot to mention: The staggered team order only comes into effect on new rounds. Any round that had already started when the changes went in continues with the old sequential order. This way, nobody loses a turn.

do the deadbeat score changes take effect in games already established?

Yes.

While not against the new changes, I am pretty dissappointed thaat you would decide to kick them in in the middle of existing games.
I had specifically joined some double turns allowed games and feel it is wrong to have changed the rules mid-game.

Ideally, changes should affect new games only. Ideally, updates should not disrupt realtime games. But solving those two issues takes extra programming time, which is very limited. I have to choose between getting more things done versus getting them live without disruption. Since the game is not mission critical (as opposed to a $100,000 poker tournament) I tend to favour more improvements. But I do apologize for any inconveniece these updates cause.

I CANT BELIEVE IT, ITS PURE PURE PURE SHIIIIIIT!

Marv, I knew you wouldn't like the staggered order from what you've already said in the suggestions forum. But I feel the majority agree that staggered is better than non-staggered. Those of you who disagree can voice your opinions as usual and I may or may not be conviced to make this feature an option or for the first round only. However, ranting and raving is not helpful or appreciated.

GREAT! Now I will look for standard games with recruits. Easy points. Even the pigeons will probably join some standard, now.

Yes, putting deadbeats back into the points does create this unfairness. Yet I believe it solves more problems that it creates. Let's see how it goes. I'm also confident that we'll make progress towards reducing deadbeating in the future.

Like the new changes..... bit of warning in advance would be good however. Im sure these changes have raised a few eyebrows and u may have pissed a few people off lack.

There is definitely room for better PR here I do read and consider everyone's opinion on a suggestion before I implement it, but from now on I will make an effort to engage in the debate and express where I'm leaning on anything controversial. This way those who disagree can try to influence me and will know what's coming beforehand.

[lackattack]

Thanks roche solide

One complication I foresee - when people sign up for doubles games, they often have a partner in mind to play alongside. Until now this was easy - you signed up right after each other and you'd know that you're partners. Does this still stand, or (as I suspect) do you have to coordinate signing up 1st and 4th or 2nd and 5th, etc? If so, I think this could mean a huge decrease in the number of doubles and triples games.

Double teams are still 1,2 vs 3,4 vs 5,6
Doubles sequential play order is now 1, 3, 5, 2, 4, 6

Triples teams are still 1,2,3 vs 4,5,6
Triples sequential play order is now 1, 4, 2, 5, 3, 6

[Marvaddin]

However, ranting and raving is not helpful or appreciated.

Can you imagine how Im happy for having my current games under a new rule I dislike, and I had no idea was coming? That was not helpful nor appreciated to me, too. I understand you side, you explained already, but try understand mine. Anyway, Im positioning myself against the change and the lack of warning, AND the lack of option, not against the site or against you. I feel myself punished. All the discussion about that I saw in the topic in the to-do list was 3 posts, in a topic about a different thing. I think you are great lack, but this was a fault to me. Sorry anyway.

[eddymush]

i like the new rules, and it wil take a while to adjust, i am a bit cionfused, i am under the impression that the new rules only effect new games started after this was implemented.
I like the idea its not suppose to be retro active however it seems a little inconsisestant.

in some of my games the order remained th same and in others it is under the new rules. either i have mis read the changes or there is a bug.

on all old games will they remain the old way or at the beginging of a new round will they change to the new ay and finally lack, i understande the need for the changes but here is my question....
we sign up 1 and 2 and then players 3 and 4 and 5 and 6 sign up. will the first player to go be random or will the first player that signs up always go first?


Keep up the great work!!!!!!

[Twill]

dfk...the old rules are in effect for one round after the change was made, then the new rules kick in...I believe

That should explain some of the inconsistency....

[hendy]

Good job lack hats off to ya ! YU have done a hell of a job in proving the site. But the only change I dont like was the freestyle doubble turns allowed. I really enjoyed it and really think it was the best part of conquerclub. Having the f-style no doubble turns allowed is good to because it gives people variety and choice. But personally the freestyle doubble turns was a very big part of conquerclub. I really dont see why u had to change it lack why not just leave em both? This changes conquerclub in a big way and its a bad way. But the other changes u have made even it out. Im not trying to be mean lack im just saying getting rid of f-style doubble turn allowed was a big mistake But thanx alot for making the other changes ur doing a great job

[eddymush]

one more question, is this correct on chained fort:
i can fortify from ontario to central america as long as i have a chain from ont to ca, but, once i hit fortify my turn is complete?

[lackattack]

we sign up 1 and 2 and then players 3 and 4 and 5 and 6 sign up. will the first player to go be random or will the first player that signs up always go first?

first player is always random in any sequential game

one more question, is this correct on chained fort:
i can fortify from ontario to central america as long as i have a chain from ont to ca, but, once i hit fortify my turn is complete?

correct

[eddymush]

lack one more, btw all changes are great!!!!!!!

on the new terminator game are points awarded immediatley opr at the end of thegame? and id they are immediate, lets say i knock out two players and then get beat, the amount i loose is based on the amount of points i have at the time of the loss not at the start of the game correct?

[garionoldwolf]

so with the terminator what happens if someone gets kicked out/deadbeats? Do they lose points still?

anyone?

[kwolff]

The changes look great, thanks..........Im sure it will be an adjustment but you put alot of time in and i wanted to say thanks

[lackattack]

so with the terminator what happens if someone gets kicked out/deadbeats? Do they lose points still?

they do not lose points in that case

on the new terminator game are points awarded immediatley opr at the end of thegame? and id they are immediate, lets say i knock out two players and then get beat, the amount i loose is based on the amount of points i have at the time of the loss not at the start of the game correct?

immediately, correct

[eddymush]

on the new terminator game are points awarded immediatley opr at the end of thegame? and id they are immediate, lets say i knock out two players and then get beat, the amount i loose is based on the amount of points i have at the time of the loss not at the start of the game correct?

immediately, correct[/quote]


thanks for the quick answer i better start eliminating. lol


keep up the good work

[TuckerCase]

Now its not a team game. Its a standard game where you dont need kill other player to win. How can I use team strategy, if I cant give my armies to my partner, so he can use and return them to me (I would be killed in other team turn!)? Where is the cooperation and the strategy?

Cooperation? Strategy? Team strategy? Is that what the old rules allowed? No, before it was simply set up so people like you (and the dirty bird's that you denounce so much, but are so similiar to) could prey on teams without instant messenger. I don't think a game type where people without instant messenger are so severely handicapped is fair to conquer club as a whole.

[AK_iceman]

hey tucker, thats what team game means. you should be able to fort your team member and work together without getting wiped out. I thought it was a great way to play, and by play i dont mean steal points from newbs.

edit: everyone has the opportunity to make friends, exchange im's and do the same. its a strategy, we arent taking advantage and its not abusing anything so just leave specific people out of it ok?