[GP] Increase to 12 Players

[fumandomuerte]

At least it should be approved for tournaments.

[sniffie]

Wouldn't it be great to have a ninth player, so that trips games could be played with 3 teams.



This will improve the following aspects of the site:
- more fun games
- less triples games wating.

Need i say more, this idea is simple and speaks for itself.

Greetings, sniffie

[jaimito101]

was it not mambo # 9?

but anyway i think upping the number of players would be a good idea, but it has been suggested before here's the last link i found about it:

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=113234&hilit=16+%26amp%3B+player


some drawbacks stated where, the difficulty with colour and some maps, but shouldnt be too hard to implement seeing battle royales are already possible....

maybe lack's holding back for old times sake? or maybe thinking of making it only available to future premium "PLUS" customers?

[2dimes]

red
green
blue
yellow
pink
cyan
orange
grey
black
purple
burgundy
lime green

There 12 unique colors.

What about leaving grey silver, call purple violet and burgandy maroon? Just need a new name for Black and the color codes are solved. Dark?

red r
green g
blue b
yellow y
pink p
cyan c
orange o
silver s
dark d
violet v
maroon m
lime l

[alex951]

brown?

[sensfan]

brown?

B: Blue
B: Brown
B: Black

uh-oh.

[PLAYER57832]

Imagine fitting twelve different players on a map like Doodle Earth.

What's the problem? Sounds like fun! (and you can bet a whole group would try it)

Seriously, it took a long time to get to 8 players. There is a limit to the size of maps and so forth an average computer screen can handle and still be understandable to most of us .. er, "older players". Also, it would change the dynamics of all maps incredibly.

[jsholty4690]

brown?

B: Blue
B: Brown
B: Black

uh-oh.

brown can become tan.

[2dimes]

Imagine fitting twelve different players on a map like Doodle Earth.

What's the problem? Sounds like fun! (and you can bet a whole group would try it)

Seriously, it took a long time to get to 8 players. There is a limit to the size of maps and so forth an average computer screen can handle and still be understandable to most of us .. er, "older players". Also, it would change the dynamics of all maps incredibly.

No I didn't. Who did you remove when adjusting the quote?
Should I make a new thread about upping it to 9?

[2dimes]

Ah here we go.

Can you imagine a 12-man doodle earth game? Or even on Luxembourg.

[PLAYER57832]

No I didn't. Who did you remove when adjusting the quote?
Should I make a new thread about upping it to 9?

Sorry, fixed it (in my post).

As for the question, I would think 10 might be next. But I just don't see it happening any time soon. Might be wrong, though.
At any rate, I would not play it. Games would just take too much time.

[PLAYER57832]

Ah here we go.

Can you imagine a 12-man doodle earth game? Or even on Luxembourg.

close, but no. However, I did fix it.. and sorry, again.

[Prankcall]

would def have to group maps
AOR's and Feudal War already can only have 6
Feudal Epic, maybe a couple others are made for a max of 8
Doodle Earth, 12 people, shoot myself in the face (same for Lux. and sort of Madagascar)

But for larger maps (Hive, World 2.1, Charleston, etc.) this would be a good idea
the mods will definitely do this sometime, or at least up it to 10, idk if there is a way to get them to do it faster (that's what she said)

I think they would basically only have to group the maps that allow for a Max amount of players,any Feudal,AoR and such where your main starting points is a bonus deploy.
Obviously any other map would work for any amount of players at Max 12(since this is the number being proposed),they would simply be more like a Battle Royal game.I would like to see it for larger maps such as 2.1,N.A,Hive and the likes.

[72o]

Concise description:

• Icons instead of colors to designate troops' allegiance.

Specifics:

• The "add more players" suggestion has come up again, and as every time before it, it has dissolved into a debate about who can see what color. Maybe we could make icons to identify each player's troops. They could be flags, or coat of arms, or something like that.

[2dimes]

Ah here we go.

Can you imagine a 12-man doodle earth game? Or even on Luxembourg.

close, but no. However, I did fix it.. and sorry, again.

No worries, just didn't want the origional dudes to lose credit for the quote.
Here's your 12 colours with different letters for colour codes.
red r
green g
blue b
yellow y
pink p
cyan c
orange o
silver s
maroon m
lime l
violet v
dark d

[jsholty4690]

Ah here we go.

Can you imagine a 12-man doodle earth game? Or even on Luxembourg.

close, but no. However, I did fix it.. and sorry, again.

No worries, just didn't want the origional dudes to lose credit for the quote.
Here's your 12 colours with different letters for colour codes.
red r
green g
blue b
yellow y
pink p
cyan c
orange o
silver s
maroon m
lime l
violet v
dark d

I don't know black can easily blend into the back ground on some of the maps (all of the space maps come to mind).

However all of the other colors are great choices.

[Rocketry]

Guess we could switch to using symbols instead of colours? square circle star triangle....?

Rocket.

[JoshyBoy]

I don't think that colours would really be that much of a problem. If the admins needed to get twelve unique colours they would easily be able to find them. I think what you need to think about here is making this a reasonable and easily achievable suggestion to implement. Going from eight players to twelve is a huge huge leap, and there are several points to consider. What about smaller maps like Doodle Earth or Luxembourg which only have eighteen and nineteen territories each? A twelve-player game on these maps would be suicide and a lot of players would be eliminated before Round One was even finished. It would be like suicide. I understand that having twelve players allows for three quads in a game, four triples teams, and six doubles teams, but why don't we start by upping the limit to just nine to see how having three larger teams in a game works? This is a less drastic change which could then lead to upping the limit to ten or more players if it works out, or be reversed if it crashes. I understand that everyone would love to win a standard or assassin twelve-player game and getting hundreds of points from one or two one of them, but the current proposal for twelve players would require a heck of a lot of work, maybe even too much.

All I'm trying to say is, why don't we make this a little simpler and easier? It might make it then with a little support from everyone.

Cheers, JB

[sonicsteve]

Even if it went up to 9 so we could do three team triples it would be a nice bonus. The reason I picked 12 is because it's functional for all 4 team types, single, doubles, triples and quads.


What if in the code it used player number instead of the first letter of color or both. The number denoting which player it is could be small while the number of troops could be the size it is now.

Kind of like 17 35 211 113 123

Or 1r7 3b5 2g11 11b3 12l3

Not that I think I would look at b for blue and mix it up with b for burgandy but. I probably could.

2dimes idea is good, but might work better with alphabeticised player references, so instead of

17 35 211 113 123

you'd have

A7 B5 C11 D3 E3

That way you couldn't get confused between player number and number of armies

[JoshyBoy]

I spoke to chipv, the head of the tech team and asked about the effects of adding new players.

There are huge changes to make even with 9 players.
In addition you are getting a significant increase of load on the servers.

One of the biggest changes is to maps. For example 12 players still could not play Feudal.
But a max of 8 players can play Feudal Epic so they could not play this now.

Map XMLs are designed and constrained by rules for a max of 8 players.
That means the gameplay of current maps would be compromised so the rules have to be changed. When rules like this change, it becomes a bigger piece of work for the site.

Smaller bits like the game finder and API would also need changing. You would also get several scripts breaking immediately.

Despite what some people say, colours would be an issue. Finding distinct colours is one problem , but for colourblind people , you also need distinct first letters too.

9 or 12 player games will also be useless for the new guy as nobody wants to risk up to 11 noobs deadbeating in any game so these will be mostly private.

Anyway, those are my initial thoughts, load on servers will be a problem.

Hope this explains things a bit more clearly to you all. Thank-you to chipv again for this information.

Cheers, JB

[jsholty4690]

I spoke to chipv, the head of the tech team and asked about the effects of adding new players.

There are huge changes to make even with 9 players.
In addition you are getting a significant increase of load on the servers.

One of the biggest changes is to maps. For example 12 players still could not play Feudal.
But a max of 8 players can play Feudal Epic so they could not play this now.

Map XMLs are designed and constrained by rules for a max of 8 players.
That means the gameplay of current maps would be compromised so the rules have to be changed. When rules like this change, it becomes a bigger piece of work for the site.

Smaller bits like the game finder and API would also need changing. You would also get several scripts breaking immediately.

Despite what some people say, colours would be an issue. Finding distinct colours is one problem , but for colourblind people , you also need distinct first letters too.

9 or 12 player games will also be useless for the new guy as nobody wants to risk up to 11 noobs deadbeating in any game so these will be mostly private.

Anyway, those are my initial thoughts, load on servers will be a problem.

Hope this explains things a bit more clearly to you all. Thank-you to chipv again for this information.

Cheers, JB

I don't think anyone here thinks this is a small undertaking (at least I don't). I understand the amount of work that will be needed to get this done, however the admin has done it before.

The debate about the Feudal maps, AORs, and the smaller maps is Bull. We have this problem now and we deal with it. We can't play with Feudal and AORs now with 8 players, so what, if we can't play with them with 12 players there are dozens of other maps we can play on. With the worries about small maps, we have that already in 8 player games on doodle earth.

The worries about the color scheme is again overhyped. Just with reading this thread alone, you can see the admin can find enough colors for 12 players.

The worries about 11 noob deadbeating is inaccurate. Noobs can't play team, speed, or any other advanced game setting or complex map, until they get their first promotion. So, I don't think we would have to worry about a bunch of deadbeaters anymore than we have to with a 8 player game.

I'm not by any way endorsing a jump to 12 players right now, but I would like to see an increase in the number of players in a game to either 9 or 10.

[chipv]

You are responding to a quoted PM of mine posted off the top of my head.
Those are minor points, dwarfed by the actual complexity of the job. So I can accept your considered opinion of "Bull" on those.
There is also a potential issue of server load.

Just to make it clear - it is a HUGE job.

Yes I know it has been done before and may well be done again, but it is more complex than is obvious, that's all.

The suggestion has been recognised, this is not the first time. Repetition doesn't help anyone.

[2dimes]

Despite what some people say, colours would be an issue. Finding distinct colours is one problem , but for colourblind people , you also need distinct first letters too.

Write 'em down.

Here's your 12 colours with different letters for colour codes.

I don't know black can easily blend into the back ground on some of the maps (all of the space maps come to mind).

However all of the other colors are great choices.

Drab it is then.

red r
green g
blue b
yellow y
pink p
cyan c
orange o
silver s
maroon m
lime l
violet v
drab d

[TheForgivenOne]

Now those look legit to me. But as Chipv said, i think take it slow, going from 9, to 10, then 12

[JoshyBoy]

I think going to 9 players to start with would be a good final proposal, and see how that works out. What does everyone think?