Clan League Season 2 [PUBLIC Discussion]

[skillfusniper33]

So are we scratching the other thread and going to have to sign up again? Or is this more of a public discussion of how to make it better for years to come?

[jpcloet]

It is both.

I cannot assume clans are in regardless as some of the original setting were deal-breakers for some clans.

[skillfusniper33]

ok. I will double check but im pretty sure that the Soldiers of war are interested.

[Chariot of Fire]

The Odd Fellows Union would like to participate

Primary contact: Chariot of Fire

Secondary contact: Shatners Bassoon

In Odd We Trust

[skillfusniper33]

Soldiers of War

Primary, Skillfusniper33

Secondary, Kilazul

[Hopscotcher]

Outlaws and Highwaymen are in!

I'm assuming the Primary and Secondary Contact is only in regards to the season?

Primary: Hopscotcher

Secondary: Pander88uk

[jackin_u_up]

The Odd Fellows Union would like to participate

Primary contact: Chariot of Fire

Secondary contact: Shatners Bassoon

In Odd We Trust

Major problem....ur not part of the CLA because u have members that belong to other clans

[jpcloet]

Neither have they completed a challenge either, but I can look past that I think given many of them played in the first league, albeit for other clans. They still have time to clean up their roster. I see 2 LOW and 1 DLPP on the TOFU roster.

[TheBro]

So we need to be in only one clan to register for the fun, or participate? As in we can sign up now, clean up the roster prior to the league starting?

[jpcloet]

So we need to be in only one clan to register for the fun, or participate? As in we can sign up now, clean up the roster prior to the league starting?

I would suggest you clean up the roster right away. Most clans want loyalty so I would choose TheBro where you want to be.

[ahunda]

I started a little discussion in our clan forum, and here are the main points so far:

Settings of the play-offs

I already posted my opinion earlier in this thread, but it seems, now I can indeed speak for IA: We don´t agree with the suggested 7 Doubles for the play-offs.

After playing a 112 game season, consisting of Doubles, Trips & Quads, it seems a rather huge let-down to see the finals, the most important games of all, be limited to such a format.

Map limitations

We can live with that, but there´s no great love for the current suggestion. It seems a bit too strict and somehow defeats the entire purpose of home games.

We´d prefer a somewhat softened limit. For example: Each map only twice in the season. Or: The 56 home games must be played on at least 30 maps, no map may be used more than twice or thrice. Or something like that.

If the limit is kept in place, it should at least be lifted for the play-offs (so that all maps can be used once in home games there again). In the grand finals, deciding the overall champion of the league (or places in the top divisions for next season respectively), the clans should be allowed to use their favourite maps.

Another suggestion: Some maps are simply not suited for Trips / Quads. One can hardly imagine a game, that is more luck-based than a Quad on Doodle or Luxembourg. Could just as well throw a coin. So here is the suggestion to limit Trips & Quads to maps with a minimum number of terrs, for example minimum 4 starting terrs per player. This would exclude random maps then, of course.

Besides those 2 points, everybody seems to be happy with the new format. The addition of Trips & Quads, the whole play-offs idea, etc.

[jpcloet]

After playing a 112 game season, consisting of Doubles, Trips & Quads, it seems a rather huge let-down to see the finals, the most important games of all, be limited to such a format.

Several people have suggested going to 8-4-4, however, I'd say 9-4-4 works better. No need for a playoff tie, upper ranked clan gets the extra home game. As for the finals, there is no real upper ranked clan, so some other method would be needed. ([sarcasm]How about a mid-season all-star game to decide?[/sarcasm])

We´d prefer a somewhat softened limit. For example: Each map only twice in the season. Or: The 56 home games must be played on at least 30 maps, no map may be used more than twice or thrice. Or something like that.

There are almost 130 available maps, no more than double for all season and playoffs would be somewhere in between. Does that seem fair. The use of maps by far was the biggest complaint I received in Season 1

If the limit is kept in place, it should at least be lifted for the play-offs (so that all maps can be used once in home games there again). In the grand finals, deciding the overall champion of the league (or places in the top divisions for next season respectively), the clans should be allowed to use their favourite maps.

There are plenty of maps, if you can use a map twice, then the clans should plan accordingly. I think that would work and maybe even alter some strategies.

Another suggestion: Some maps are simply not suited for Trips / Quads. One can hardly imagine a game, that is more luck-based than a Quad on Doodle or Luxembourg. Could just as well throw a coin. So here is the suggestion to limit Trips & Quads to maps with a minimum number of terrs, for example minimum 4 starting terrs per player. This would exclude random maps then, of course.

I see your argument for sure, however, if a clan wants to pick a map, should they not be able to if they have not picked it yet? There likely is more luck involved, however, some of the best quad games I've had of late have been on smaller maps. I would like to think that the clans in D1 along with your clans would not likely pick maps like that for quads.

[Bruceswar]

It would be a great strategy for a lesser clan to pick a map like doodle earth in a quads to luck into a victory. I agree we need some sort of limits to triples and quads. There are only a few maps that should be off limits for those.

[jpcloet]

It would be a great strategy for a lesser clan to pick a map like doodle earth in a quads to luck into a victory. I agree we need some sort of limits to triples and quads. There are only a few maps that should be off limits for those.

If you go this route, would it be ok to limit the use of complicate maps then?

[the.killing.44]

It would be a great strategy for a lesser clan to pick a map like doodle earth in a quads to luck into a victory. I agree we need some sort of limits to triples and quads. There are only a few maps that should be off limits for those.

If you go this route, would it be ok to limit the use of complicate maps then?

I say no — why limit someone's skill on a hard map, just proving they're good? Though a 'complex' one like City Mogul would be held differently versus Waterloo or Forbidden City I think.

• Doodle Earth
• Luxembourg
• Egypt: Lower
• Egypt: Upper
• Duck & Cover

.44

[Hopscotcher]

I personally feel it is silly to limit the choice of maps. You can not repeat maps, so even if a clan does choose Doodle, they can only do so once unless it comes up from Random. I think the more options available, the more fun it is in the long run. After all, a bad drop can kill just as easily as Dice and turn order.

[niMic]

It would be a great strategy for a lesser clan to pick a map like doodle earth in a quads to luck into a victory. I agree we need some sort of limits to triples and quads. There are only a few maps that should be off limits for those.

If you go this route, would it be ok to limit the use of complicate maps then?

The point isn't to limit maps because they're more complicated or less complicated, but to limit maps which will almost entirely be decided on luck.

[Hopscotcher]

It would be a great strategy for a lesser clan to pick a map like doodle earth in a quads to luck into a victory. I agree we need some sort of limits to triples and quads. There are only a few maps that should be off limits for those.

If you go this route, would it be ok to limit the use of complicate maps then?

The point isn't to limit maps because they're more complicated or less complicated, but to limit maps which will almost entirely be decided on luck.

You mean to limit maps that are decided by rolling dice?

[Bruceswar]

It would be a great strategy for a lesser clan to pick a map like doodle earth in a quads to luck into a victory. I agree we need some sort of limits to triples and quads. There are only a few maps that should be off limits for those.

If you go this route, would it be ok to limit the use of complicate maps then?

The point isn't to limit maps because they're more complicated or less complicated, but to limit maps which will almost entirely be decided on luck.

You mean to limit maps that are decided by rolling dice?

Let me put it to you this way....

Doodle earth... Each person starts with 2 territories... First person to go takes one from the last person in line. Now the 2nd team has a person with 1 spot left and must drop on him to save him, so player 1 for team 2 drops on him. Player 2 for team 1 goes and takes another player down to 1 spot.. now team 2 has 2 at 1 spot while team 1 has all 4 with at least 2 spots.... See where this is going...

[DAAAAAAANG]

I think for quads and trips maps each player should start with at least start 3 regions. I would say 4, but I think that would be a little too restricting with the no repeat maps rule.

[Bones2484]

If a clan wants their HOME games to be based purely on luck, so be it.

[jpcloet]

If a clan wants their HOME games to be based purely on luck, so be it.

That's what I was trying to lead to, just wanted to see the other arguments. I have seen players eliminated without taking a turn in quads, but luck is a factor in all games regardless or how much there is of it. Lucky maps and settings should be allowed, but each person's view of luck and skill can vary quite a bit.

How about this:

Someone (who ever has done this work already) prepares a list of recommended quad maps so that at least all the clans are informed of which maps are best suited to quads In Your Opinion. The Clan Directors will monitor the map usage as we already plan to, and if there is a serious issue or abuse in some way, we will intervene, otherwise we will see how it goes and look at changing for season 3 if there is an issue.

[Hopscotcher]

Let me put it to you this way....

Doodle earth... Each person starts with 2 territories... First person to go takes one from the last person in line. Now the 2nd team has a person with 1 spot left and must drop on him to save him, so player 1 for team 2 drops on him. Player 2 for team 1 goes and takes another player down to 1 spot.. now team 2 has 2 at 1 spot while team 1 has all 4 with at least 2 spots.... See where this is going...

I understand your argument. What I don't understand is how there is any guarantee you will go first. Aside that, you are assuming you will get a kill with 6 v 3 which is not always true. Were I to play Doodle for example and had first turn, methinks I would drop one on three players so that very thing wouldn't happen. With close knit territories, there could actually be quite a bit of maneuvering in strategy.

Granted, that's not how it is usually played, but it's possible.

I just think telling clans which maps they can and can't use for which games is going across a line. We have the no double map rule. That should be sufficient.

I just played a Trips game on Supermax. We got dropped 5 of the 6 Gang Leaders and I went first and took the 6th one. It was a long rout with no hope for the other team. They put up a fight, but our drop was just too good. Just an example of how a huge map can still kill you with luck.

[Bruceswar]

Does not matter who goes first... You have a 50/50 chance and the rest is history. I do not like a quads game where the very first move tells you who will win or not.

[Hopscotcher]

Does not matter who goes first... You have a 50/50 chance and the rest is history. I do not like a quads game where the very first move tells you who will win or not.

I hate Pearl Harbor. Can we ban that?

All I'm saying is..... why limit the home games?