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mpjh wrote:I was on one of my frequent walks through the Chihuahua desert and ran low on water. After resting in the shade of a giant yucca, I decided to try and make it back to base camp in the heat of the day. Wrong move. Half way there, out of water, and in the searing sun, I met up with two beings arguing. Each had huge feather wings, and glowed with a light not from the hot sun. I knew in my gut that I was dealing with angels. They argued loudly, each accusing the other of "betraying" the "lord." I got the impression that one came from the exiled and one from the favorites. I decided to intervene. I walked up close and put one hand on each of the angels. The sensation was exhilarating. I said "Can't we all get get along." The angels were thunderstruck, turned to each other and embraced. The embrace went on for some time -- I got uncomfortable and backed away. They then started making out and humping right there on the desert floor. I guess the rift in heaven is over.
Miraculously, I was able to make it back to base camp without need for any more water.
mpjh wrote:john9blue wrote:Interesting... although I'm not that concerned because many great thinkers were religious. There are definitely more impressionable types in the lower IQ range who are less likely to question religious dogma.
Where is your evidence of that. My experience has been that IQ is only a social construct, and that "higher" IQ people are simply closer to the elite of the mainstream and more likely to agree with the prevailing ideology; while lower "IQ" people are more likely the oppressed in that society and more likely to challange the prevailing ideology. So I see quite the opposite of what you claim.
mpjh wrote:Pure bunkum. The United States is the most religious country in the world (at least before the Great Recession). The poor throughout the world resist domination by religion and constantly question why they should believe in a god that totally lacks compassion.
AAFitz wrote:mpjh wrote:Pure bunkum. The United States is the most religious country in the world (at least before the Great Recession). The poor throughout the world resist domination by religion and constantly question why they should believe in a god that totally lacks compassion.
Pure Fantasy.... The United States is barely religious at all. We have people who claim to believe, but they do barely nothing to show it for the most part. Maybe, some go to church on Sundays, but most dont even do that. In the actual religious parts of the world, the people spend every day worshiping their God, and abide by the rules till death.
On the whole, the country is so fragmented in its beliefs, that its impossible to call it the most religious, even blasphemous if you will.
Napoleon Ier wrote:You people need to grow up to be honest.
PLAYER57832 wrote:AAFitz wrote:mpjh wrote:Pure bunkum. The United States is the most religious country in the world (at least before the Great Recession). The poor throughout the world resist domination by religion and constantly question why they should believe in a god that totally lacks compassion.
Pure Fantasy.... The United States is barely religious at all. We have people who claim to believe, but they do barely nothing to show it for the most part. Maybe, some go to church on Sundays, but most dont even do that. In the actual religious parts of the world, the people spend every day worshiping their God, and abide by the rules till death.
On the whole, the country is so fragmented in its beliefs, that its impossible to call it the most religious, even blasphemous if you will.
You are both wrong. Over 90% of those in the US believe in God. An overwhelming majority describe themselves as "religious" or "spiritual".
The numbers are even higher in poorer areas. They may despair at God/gods, but most cannot even conceive of a world without religious belief.
Neoteny wrote:No no, what AAFitz is saying is that Americans aren't "truly" religious, which means they don't match up with what he considers "religious." It's a pompous ass thing.
AAFitz wrote:Neoteny wrote:No no, what AAFitz is saying is that Americans aren't "truly" religious, which means they don't match up with what he considers "religious." It's a pompous ass thing.
Its more of a realistic ass thing. But thanks for clarifying his error. I knew before he posted, Id have to come back and explain.
PLAYER57832 wrote:AAFitz wrote:Neoteny wrote:No no, what AAFitz is saying is that Americans aren't "truly" religious, which means they don't match up with what he considers "religious." It's a pompous ass thing.
Its more of a realistic ass thing. But thanks for clarifying his error. I knew before he posted, Id have to come back and explain.
Here is my source:
http://religions.pewforum.org/reports
The number of atheists and the numbers of people who switch from one church to another is increasing, but American is still overwhelmingly religious.
Do not confuse disdain for church with disdain for religion. If you asked me what church I belong to, my answer would be somewhat complicated. I am a member of one church, but attend it only sometimes, send my kids to Sunday school elsewhere and have them involved in youth programs affiliated with yet another church. However, I am absolutely Christian.
mpjh wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:AAFitz wrote:mpjh wrote:Pure bunkum. The United States is the most religious country in the world (at least before the Great Recession). The poor throughout the world resist domination by religion and constantly question why they should believe in a god that totally lacks compassion.
Pure Fantasy.... The United States is barely religious at all. We have people who claim to believe, but they do barely nothing to show it for the most part. Maybe, some go to church on Sundays, but most dont even do that. In the actual religious parts of the world, the people spend every day worshiping their God, and abide by the rules till death.
On the whole, the country is so fragmented in its beliefs, that its impossible to call it the most religious, even blasphemous if you will.
You are both wrong. Over 90% of those in the US believe in God. An overwhelming majority describe themselves as "religious" or "spiritual".
The numbers are even higher in poorer areas. They may despair at God/gods, but most cannot even conceive of a world without religious belief.
Sorry, but all the socialists and communists that are getting elected around the world are in the poorer areas, and their support is among the poorest of those areas. No, religion is not their friend and they know it.
AAFitz wrote:You are truly religious, and obviously try to live your life according to the beliefs of your religion. I am more referring to those who pretend to believe, and then live their lives completely contradictory to those beliefs. They are no more religious than someone who calls themselves a Star Wars fanatic, who has never seen the movie. Sure, statistically, they might be counted, but that doesnt mean they are actually Star Wars fanatics. Whether they think they are or not is irrelevant.
AAFitz wrote:PLAYER57832 wrote:AAFitz wrote:Neoteny wrote:No no, what AAFitz is saying is that Americans aren't "truly" religious, which means they don't match up with what he considers "religious." It's a pompous ass thing.
Its more of a realistic ass thing. But thanks for clarifying his error. I knew before he posted, Id have to come back and explain.
Here is my source:
http://religions.pewforum.org/reports
The number of atheists and the numbers of people who switch from one church to another is increasing, but American is still overwhelmingly religious.
Do not confuse disdain for church with disdain for religion. If you asked me what church I belong to, my answer would be somewhat complicated. I am a member of one church, but attend it only sometimes, send my kids to Sunday school elsewhere and have them involved in youth programs affiliated with yet another church. However, I am absolutely Christian.
You are truly religious, and obviously try to live your life according to the beliefs of your religion. I am more referring to those who pretend to believe, and then live their lives completely contradictory to those beliefs. They are no more religious than someone who calls themselves a Star Wars fanatic, who has never seen the movie. Sure, statistically, they might be counted, but that doesnt mean they are actually Star Wars fanatics. Whether they think they are or not is irrelevant.
AAFitz wrote:Neoteny wrote:No no, what AAFitz is saying is that Americans aren't "truly" religious, which means they don't match up with what he considers "religious." It's a pompous ass thing.
Its more of a realistic ass thing. But thanks for clarifying. I knew before he posted, Id have to come back and explain.
If you chose that saying you believe, and not acting in accordance with those beliefs, or showing them in nearly any way makes you "religious", and just as much as "religious" as others who clearly devote their lives and actions to those beliefs, than thats fine...
Add me to your stats then: I believe. I guess Im "religious" now...just ignore the fact that my actions will not reflect this in any way whatsoever, and the fact that Im simply making it up.
Ironically, I am more religious than many professed believers, which is where your incorrect assesment of pompous came from. I actually believe in the teachings of the church, the teachings of Jesus himself, and try to live my life guided by those principles as much as I possibly can. It just so happens that I believe in them, because I believe they are a just and admirable way to live a life, not because they came from a supernatural power. It is knowing these principles, and seeing those that pretend to believe in the originator of them, and then ignoring every aspect of them, that allows me to not consider them religious.
Its not pompous...its educated.
Pompous might be someone who, in professing to believe in Jesus, would in his supposed defense, resort to personal quips and character assassinations. It would also be ironic. It would of course not be novel.... Religious people have been using their beliefs in an effort to control others since the dawn of religion itself.
AAFitz wrote:Pure Fantasy.... The United States is barely religious at all. We have people who claim to believe, but they do barely nothing to show it for the most part. Maybe, some go to church on Sundays, but most dont even do that. In the actual religious parts of the world, the people spend every day worshiping their God, and abide by the rules till death.
Napoleon Ier wrote:You people need to grow up to be honest.
Napoleon Ier wrote:You people need to grow up to be honest.
Sure:MeDeFe wrote:jesterhawk, can you point me to the part in the bible where the devil's rebellion is described in as great detail as in your post? I've never been able to find it.
To quote from my favorite movie, "In my experience there is no such thing as luck!"MeDeFe wrote:Regarding your illness, I'm glad you recovered from it, but doctors aren't infallible, so yes, you "just" got really really lucky.
The above passages make it clear that God did create the devil but that he was the star of the morning (Isaiah 14:12), an anointed cherub (Ezekiel 28:14), and blameless until he turned to evil (Ezekiel 28:15). Now one could argue that God knew he would turn to evil, but that was not what he was created for it was what he choose. Just like we were not created to murder, rape, steal, etc, but we choose to do those things.jonesthecurl wrote:Did God deliberately make "the Devil" evil?
I am glad that you made it back safely. As for the rest, the war or rift between God and the devil is not over yet.mpjh wrote:I was on one of my frequent walks through the Chihuahua desert and ran low on water. After resting in the shade of a giant yucca, I decided to try and make it back to base camp in the heat of the day. Wrong move. Half way there, out of water, and in the searing sun, I met up with two beings arguing. Each had huge feather wings, and glowed with a light not from the hot sun. I knew in my gut that I was dealing with angels. They argued loudly, each accusing the other of "betraying" the "lord." I got the impression that one came from the exiled and one from the favorites. I decided to intervene. I walked up close and put one hand on each of the angels. The sensation was exhilarating. I said "Can't we all get get along." The angels were thunderstruck, turned to each other and embraced. The embrace went on for some time -- I got uncomfortable and backed away. They then started making out and humping right there on the desert floor. I guess the rift in heaven is over.
Miraculously, I was able to make it back to base camp without need for any more water.
jonesthecurl wrote:...so did God plan for Lucifer to turn to evil?
PLAYER57832 wrote:jonesthecurl wrote:...so did God plan for Lucifer to turn to evil?
Plan.. no.
Allow it to happen, know that when he made Lucifer the way he was it would happen.. yes.